Live Thread: Cavs at Timberwolves
2016-01-08
The Cleveland Cavaliers take their five-game winning streak to the Twin Cities tonight as they face the Minnesota Timberwolves for the first time this season. While a contest between the 24-9 Cavaliers and the 12-24 Timberwolves seems like a ho-hum route waiting to happen, a little trade that took place on August 23, 2014 will always make it more than that.
The idea that Andrew Wiggins was too steep a price to pay for Kevin Love has been a common narrative among basketball pundits. There’s no doubt that Wiggins has shown tremendous promise, averaging 20.1 points per game in just his second season. Along with Karl-Anthony Towns, Wiggins gives Minnesota a tremendous duo of young players to build around, complimented by other young prospects such as Shabazz Muhammad and Gorgui Dieng. But does that mean the Cavaliers made a mistake by trading the former number one overall pick?
Absolutely not. The Cavaliers are trying to win a championship while LeBron James is still in his prime, and the 27 year old Love is still a significantly more effective player than the 20 year old Wiggins at this point. Yes, Wiggins does have the higher scoring average by nearly four points per game, but that’s where it ends. Love has a significant edge in rebounds and assists per game, three-point shooting, PER, and RPM. While RPM isn’t a perfect statistic—what is?—it’s pretty significant that Love’s 5.41 mark is good enough for eleventh in the entire league, while Wiggins is rated 80th among shooting guards alone with a RPM of -4.20. He’s a long way from being a core piece on a contender, let alone a superstar. [Editor’s Note: RAPM over at least a season’s worth of games is superior to partial season RPM (or RAPM).  Over the last couple seasons, Love has posted a RAPM of ~3.2 while Wiggins’ first season netted him a MINUS 3.2]
Still, Wiggins seems to get up for playing against the team that drafted him, averaging 30 points per game against the Cavaliers in two games last season, his highest scoring average against any team. If he does that again, then tonight’s game could be much more of a battle for the Cavaliers than anyone expects. Be sure to tune in tonight at 8:00 on ESPN and share your thoughts on the game here at Cavs: The Blog!
Bad sequence there… lazy pass, then Mozzy banana…
Yikes, that open 3 by KLOVE was ugly.
Man Shump! That’s a Shaqtin’ a Fool moment.
Wide open… smh
Nice patience and jumper by KLOVE!
3 quick fouls by Jefferson in Shabazz.
Jefferson having a tough time against #15
Mohammed, scrub fuego de jour!
RJ defensive struggles continues……
MOZ with the high arching jumper!
Love checking back in…
They said Love got hit in the hip. Mosgov not doing bad out there with Tristan.
Nice roll to the hoop by KAT.
Towns looks good!
Woah…. Shump a little out of control there, bailed out by the foul.
Shump needs to dial it back a little on offense. He’s playing like he’s the go-to guy.
Man… the Wolves really don’t like to play defense do they…
Funny enough, their defensive efficiency is ranked 18th.. so it’s not the worst HAHA!
Shabbaz looking to score against the Cavs’ backups.
Shabazz is really 58 years old.
Shump with some trouble finishing around the hoop.
Kevin Loves daily run to the locker room then jump on a bike.
Nice defense there on the ball by the Cavs.
yeah that was really nice. Fought through every screen like it was the last possession of the game.
Just got caught up… why no Moz earlier against bigger Pekovic and KAT lineup?
Good question… KAT was killing the Cavs early because he was the biggest man on the court.
Guess it’s not just when teams play small ball that he sits…
Wow… so great offense and mediocre defense on Wiggins so far from the Cavs.
Pretty good scoring start from the Cavs.
Kevin Love just went to the locker room with trainer Steve Spiro. He was limping a bit after landing awkwardly earlier. – Haynes
Saw that too… hope it’s not serious.
I actually like the Wolves unis. Better than the old ones.
Woah! Shump with the move and the drain~!
AND AGAIN!!! Shumptastic!
Shump hitting Js off the dribble. /swooooon
HAHA… no kidding. No hesitation either.
Shump on Wiggins now.
What a great find by LBJ to cutting Delly!
Mozzy and Shump !!
Lefty windmill by the “Old Guy” lol
Kevin is up for this game.
If Wiggins gets pumped against the Cavs, would be nice if the Cavs rose to the challenge of defending him.
JR getting exposed on that end plus Wiggins shooting the jumper well, which he normally doesn’t do.
NICE!! AC Credits Lebron’s New shoes to last basket!
Nice run out by JR!!!
THe Delly Lama is by far the best Delly memes!
Take that Minny fans – KLOVE
Working the rookie!!!
Kevinana!
Nice find by LBJ, Delly missing the 3…. but KLOVE has his back!
JVG doesn’t like the Cavs.
Yikes that sucks for you. Listening to my favorite duo Ac and Fred
Finally a basket for Love
Great one on one play by Love. His footwork is top notch
Big time LeTravel before that Delly trey.
LMAO Where do you guys find this stuff?
Delly bails LBJ out on the drive with a 3 bomb!
Delly forces the quick T-Wolves TO.
Delly Trey!!!!!!!!!!!!
Generous foul call.
Pek gets Mo Gotti theme music.
Pekovic looks so much like Zangief from Street Fighter
I just said that.
Or the villain from Superman.
Zangief back after a year!
LOL. Did not see this when I posted.
HAHAHA… we’re all on the same page!
Keep shooting JR!!!
Pekovic is one ugly dude!
May be a touch matchup for TT.
That is what I was thinking.
Cavs going after Rubio on the defensive end.
Didn’t realize Andre Miller was the oldest in league.
Great job by JR!
He looks like he’s on tonight!
what a swing!
So far, Kyrie is the only one coming to play for the Cavs. Towns’ size is a big problem. Wiggins still angry that LBJ snubbed him in his letter.
Cavs look real tentative.
Kyrie put Drew in a blender.
Towns already a problem with his size.. and Kyrie with the pretty drive!
Just blew by Wiggins right there!
WOW… terrible lay up attempt by KLOVE
JR with the bail out fadeaway
Kyrie with the KISS! of the glass.
Kat is soo good.
Sam Mitchell talking about Kyrie being top 2-3 PG if not the best. I’ve always like Sam Mitchell. Glad he was there when Flip was sick. Still can’t believe he’s gone.
Sage said 4 first round players will start tonight for the first time. It’s actually 5… KG, Bron, Towns, Irving, Wiggins
Noticed that too… I was racking my brain thinking, “isn’t KAT a number 1 pick?”
It’s number 1 picks, not first round. KG wasn’t drafted number 1.
Could THIS be the game Mo gets back into his groove and drops 50! Stay tuned
Doubt he plays. Sounds like it’ll be 6 weeks for full recovery. He can still play, but why push it? He’s not very valuable anyways, may as well not play an even less effective Mo.
Was joking and also apparently forgot he is hurt. So yeah…this won’t be the night.
Good evening CtB! Here are your numbers for tonight:
CLE is a 10 point favorite over MIN with an o/u @ 195. Smart money is on MIN covering and the UNDER… with nearly 2/3 of betting public taking a CLE cover and the OVER.
As always, I will go with Vegas taking CLE 101-92 over MIN. I think being at home as well as the size and athleticism of MIN gives problems to the offense of CLE, but the abject incompetence of MIN’s offense will allow the defense of CLE to take over the game.
GO CAVS!
I think the public might be right here. We don’t really have anyone that matches up well with KAT, however, I see KI to continue both his scoring, and just as importantly, drawing attention from LBJ and J.R. for a three party.
However, after getting burned by John Wall the other day, I’ll go conservative – MIN to cover, but taking the over. going 24 billion this time – got to make up my 12B from last game.
Probably a good idea on the betting. If you’re betting more than 24 billion on a single game, you have a problem.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Good point here.
HAHAHAHA! By all means make that money JoeyB! The cover is a great bet so far this year when the Cavs play on the road against a sub .500 team, going 1-10-1 ATS in the last 12 against sub .500 teams. Interestingly, the Cavs are also 15-18 on the o/u on the year. Also the Cavs are 14-18-1 ATS this year. I totally agree… that KAT matchup/mismatch sticks out like a sore thumb. Also, the Cavs’ bench sans Mo will struggle to score, and I half expect Muhammed or Dieng (sp.?) to go scrub fuego. Thank goodness for a surging… Read more »
I expect Wiggins to have a good game. He always seems to get up for the Cavs. In the end, I expect the Wolves to struggle on offense too much to win.
I agree on both counts… although having Shump back really helps with Wiggins’ athleticism even if Shump’s giving up a couple inches.
Oops. It was still a good deal for the Timberwolves considering Love was going to leave.
Flip did an excellent job on that recognizing his leverage. The Cavs didn’t want to wait because they knew it was going to take time to work him in and that there was a danger of someone else coming in and giving a better deal. It certainly sped up the timeline to win for the Cavs, since having Wiggins at the two would have meant probably no Shump and J.R.
Yeah, pretty much. I have zero desire to rehash the Love trade yet again, but it’s clear it was pretty good for both teams, and the Wolves did well to get something for essentiall nothing.
I agree that Love is the better player and better fit, but it was still a
Oh geez. Look at that deal now. Love is clearly better than Wiggins the last two years, and it looks like he’ll be better than Wiggins for the life of the contract he just signed. The Cavs easily got the better player in that trade.
ESPN did a piece on it today, but we don’t even need it. Love>>Wiggins. It’s nuts that people think this is even close.
I read the piece and ESPN sees it as a good deal for both teams. Love is better with us than Wiggins would be during this title run.