Recap: Kings 124, Cavs 118
2013-01-14
The Cavs lost narrowly in a game that featured no defense whatsoever. Let us recap:
–I’m not going to worry too much about the outcome of this one. Or any other Cavs game this year, for that matter. The Cavs struggled down the stretch after clawing their way back into the game in the third quarter and came up short. It’s nothing to lose sleep over. But one troubling thing: we got a serious dose of Kyrie Irving isolations, and normally, I’m fine with Kyrie Irving isolations late in games because I like seeing him dart down the lane through a double team and around a looming big man, but in this particular game, Dion Waiters was playing terrifically, and I would have liked, if Byron Scott could have possibly been bothered to coach this team a little bit, if Waiters could have slid into the corner-three spot normally occupied by Alonzo Gee so that Irving would have a better option to pass to when he inevitably got double-teamed as he tried to dart into the lane. Instead nothing changed, Irving got stripped a couple of times driving to the bucket, easy lay-ins for the Kings, etc. Maybe Kyrie wouldn’t have passed the ball to Waiters either, but, y’know, maybe at least get the guy who had flames shooting out of his butt into a position where he might possibly touch the ball so that the defense has to think about him.
–By the way, this might have been Dion Waiters’s best game as a Cavalier. (With the time he rained flames from heavens against the Clippers being his other notably great game.) Saint Weirdo was really smart in taking it to the rim and drawing fouls in the first half, and then at some point in the fourth quarter, he did that Dion Waiters thing where he took some unconscionably bad shots and just kept hitting them. He finished the game with 33 points on 12-for-18 shooting. He also got to the line eight times (converting six of his attempts), and pitched in five assists. A really, really impressive performance, even against sub-par defense. It’s these sorts of games that give us hope.
–Tristan Thompson had a nice game as well, putting up 17 points and 15 rebounds. He also was the only guy on the court who seemed to bother DeMarcus Cousins (who played very well: 26 points and 14 boards) when DMC caught the ball near the paint. Another coaching note: if TT was the only player on the Cavs’ roster capable of keeping Cousins somewhat in check, why was Zeller allowed anywhere near him? I can perhaps see the wisdom in not sticking Zeller on Thomas Robinson because T-Rob’s a little too athletic for him, but why wasn’t Jason Thompson (a good player in his own right, but he’s no DMC) Zeller’s assignment whenever he was on the floor? I’m not criticizing Zeller at all for getting beat up by Cousins: he just can’t handle him at this point in his career. He was put in a position to fail, and I don’t really understand why. Besides, it seems like Thompson is beginning to relish his role as a defensive stopper. With Andy out, why not throw him on the other team’s best big the whole game and see what he can do?
–I would analyze other players in this game, but it’s difficult to parse the numbers in a contest that featured almost no defense. 12 players finished with double-digit scoring totals, and the teams combined to shoot 49% from the field. Under normal circumstances, I would be applauding #FREECASSPI for putting up 10 points or C.J. Miles for putting up a (I swear) very quiet 17 points, but, y’know, this one finished 124-to-118, so those numbers are a little inflated. It was a fun game to watch, though, especially if you like freneticism for freneticism’s sake.
The Cavs travel to Portland Wednesday to take on the Trail Blazers. Dame Lillard v. Kyrie Irving should be fantastic. Until tomorrow, friends.
Another match up to watch will be Zeller and Hickson. JJ doesn’t have the size to play center. Tyler should be able to take advantage. If Portland double teams (I’m guessing they will), he needs to find the open man. Cavs should have open looks tonight.
and by interested I mean INTERESTING
Swirving –
Totally fair. I definitely bemoaned the pick itself, but I always said everything with the caveat that I’d be beyond happy if he put it together.
Tonight will be an interested match up for TT since Aldridge is longer/uses more finesse than TT usually goes up against.
No KJ, you did a single game. Name me any rookie who averaged 25 minutes a game, and I bet I can find a one game sample from that season to use 3 or 4 stats from that puts them in elite company. Not nearly as easy to partition someone into elite or poor company based on season stats. I’m glad Hollinger likes him, I respect Hollingers opinion more than most other espn guys, but he and his methods are still wrong from time to time. I don’t think or hope that he’ll be wrong on Dion, but right now… Read more »
As far as hitting/missing on draft picks, Carter hit the nail on the head – it’s very difficult to know how well a guy is going to perform at the NBA level. Even Hollinger’s draft rater admittedly misses on guys – most notable recent examples include Michael Beasley and Tyrus Thomas (off the charts good on DR). To me, whether or not Dion becomes D-Wade light or Barnes becomes the next Carmelo Anthony is not really a reflection of the GM selecting in the draft but the player development. As far as drafting goes, I think the GM is more… Read more »
I love everything about Dion – except he can’t shoot and he thinks he can. I love the pick (saw the draft rater Versus is referencing) and I knew people from Syracuse that loved him. Chad ford said a few execs were convinced Waiters was the only player not named Davis from this class with superstar potential. I can do enough mental gymnastics to see it too. Dwayne Wade’s not a great shooter, Russell Westbrook’s not a great shooter, Tony Parker’s not a great shooter. Monta Ellis isn’t a great shooter. Those guys can flat out score because they can… Read more »
@shepsie
Hollinger, a noted stats guy, actually had Dion pretty high in his pre-draft rankings and wrote that players with his profile rarely fail. So not all the stats geeks are necessarily anti-dion, although his efficiency has been seriously lacking.
Dion seems a likely candidate to be a high-volume shooter whose ppt avg is high but FG% is relatively low. Stat geeks will hate him; the general public will think he’s great. Remind me of another Syracuse player. Also, Bradley Beal seems to fit this same mold.
Alright, commenters. I’ve not been afraid to critique this blog in the past, but this is getting absurd. What do you guys want from them? They recap games. If the Cavs get murdered in one of those games, they must recap why that happened. If that loss happened in part because Dion had a really poor shooting night from the field, then that’s what they write about. There was hand-wringing over Tristan and at the time, he was struggling. It makes sense, especially if you’re asking these guys to comment on a player’s play on a game-by-game basis. Tristan has… Read more »
Alright, commenters. I’ve not been afraid to critique this blog in the past, but this is getting absurd. What do you guys want from them? They recap games. If the Cavs get murdered in one of those games, they must recap why that happened. If that loss happened in part because Dion had a really poor shooting night from the field, then that’s what they write about. There was hand-wringing over Tristan and at the time, he was struggling. It makes sense, especially if you’re asking these guys to comment on a player’s play on a game-by-game basis. Tristan has… Read more »
Cols, I guarantee that absolutely no one would be saying that about Beal. There’s a reason no one is clamoring for him.
To your Tristan point, I’m pretty sure I CLEARLY, on NUMEROUS occasions, said that I would be happy if Tristan improved, which he did. I merely pointed out that, at the time, Tristan was a mess.
In Waiters I trust.
Even the great D Wade gets benched in the 4th QTR fellas. Lets just let the kids play and see how they grow. Teams this young always lose… trends prove that.
Too much bulldog in Waiters and too much swag/bball iq/talent in Kyrie to keep losing. Over time it will all work out.
FWIW I think Tom has been really good about the Tristan thing. Mallory is whack
Tom P – I agree on TT. You guys are coming around and have been fair on him of late. But I do think you are still a bit too harsh on Waiters. Dude is a rookie with CLEAR elite talent to get to rim. Yes, he takes bad shots and yes his D is erratic, but I think assessments of his FUTURE production should give minimal weight to those elements because they are likely to progress with time. At this point, it is clear that drafting him at 4 was not a reach. As fans, we should be rooting… Read more »
Here’s my take on the Waiters thing. If Beal had been available and we had drafted him and he was playing exactly like Waiters, people would be thrilled. We’d be hearing how good he was at such a young age and every optimistic thing would be elevated.
However since we drafted Waiters, who was on almost no one’s radar, and he spent the summer sucking, every single negative thing is elevated.
I really do think it’s this simple.
I will admit I was harsh on TT early. Great turnaround. Though everyone banging on JV remember he is 20 and only a handful of months into his first NBA season. Anyways I’d still take TT right now. Seems the difference between a good and bad Dion night is free throws. He gets to the line and gets confident his % stays up. He gets dismissed on calls and suddenly the step-back shots start coming. As for Scott, for all we talk about him trying or trying not to teach guys on the bench a lesson he sure doesn’t seem… Read more »
But Kyrieswing EVERY one of those players in my example had at LEAST one All-Star caliber season in the NBA. Furthermore, I have something else that so many of you seem to forget…Hollinger’s Draft Rater. His numbers for Dion were great. They were super great for Kyrie and near-great for TT. Seems to me Hollinger’s draft rater is pretty good. So, I have that with what I’ve seen with my own two damn eyes and last night. Btw, Dion so far has the single best offensive game of any rookie so far. Period. Btw, in regards to your last sentence;… Read more »
And I know my 25 game Dion sample is small, but if you are singling out one arbitrary game that makes it mean that much less. Take any rookie who ever had 1 really good game and set all the stats up for that game, and they’ll be in some good company. its a little harder to do that for a player’s season stats for a couple basic catagories.
Mallory are you serious? You spent most of this season bitching about Tristan Thompson. It’s in nearly every post and podcast by you. You were wrong about him. Loudly. Often.
Yes, KJ, two can play that game. My point is not to say Dion Sucks, but to say that there are serious red flags to go along with the positive developments. He is by no means a sure thing to be an above average player, was my point. I believe he will be, but you and I have obvious biases.
See, my problem wasn’t with people who questioned Thompson. It was the people who based on a single 22 point, 7 rebound game from Jonas, decided the Cavs made a huge mistake. On one game.
Oh, and on that list, Dion played the second fewest minutes of anyone. 33 points in 29 minutes! Dang!
Forgot the link: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id=&match=game&year_min=&year_max=&age_min=18&age_max=21&team_id=&opp_id=&is_playoffs=&round_is_ec1=Y&round_is_ecs=Y&round_is_ecf=Y&round_is_wc1=Y&round_is_wcs=Y&round_is_wcf=Y&round_is_fin=Y&game_num_type=&game_num_min=&game_num_max=&game_month=&game_location=&game_result=&is_starter=&is_active=&is_hof=&pos_is_g=Y&c1stat=fga&c1comp=lt&c1val=25&c2stat=pts&c2comp=gt&c2val=33&c3stat=ast&c3comp=gt&c3val=5&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=pts
And yet, he is shooting better than Beal and Beal gets more minutes. Look, Lilard is shooting 41%. Beal 37%. That’s apples-to-apples, baby. Harden shot 40% and averaged 9 points a game. Also go look at the company Dion is in on based on his performance last night. Some pretty impressive names in that small company of rookie guards who had a game like that. So, see? Two can play that game! ;-)
KJ, not many young players at all shoot as bad and as often dion waiters and actually stay on the court enough to get to 14 points a game. I mean if I played 48 minutes a game I’m sure I could luck my way into 4 or 5 points a night, simply being the second highest scoring rookie in no way means he can’t be a bust. http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&type=totals&per_minute_base=36&lg_id=NBA&is_playoffs=N&year_min=&year_max=&franch_id=&season_start=1&season_end=2&age_min=0&age_max=99&height_min=0&height_max=99&birth_country_is=Y&birth_country=&is_active=&is_hof=&is_as=&as_comp=gt&as_val=&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&qual=&c1stat=fg_pct&c1comp=lt&c1val=.39&c2stat=pts_per_g&c2comp=gt&c2val=14&c3stat=fg3_pct&c3comp=lt&c3val=.34&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&c5stat=&c5comp=gt&c6mult=1.0&c6stat=&order_by=ws In fact, it looks like on 3 other 1st or second year players have ever shot as bad as dion from fg% or 3pt%, and gotten to 14 points a game.… Read more »
Jim Boeheim in an ESPN chat yesterday, talking about Dion: “He’s as physically talented as any player I’ve ever had. He has the ability to make plays off the dribble. He’s physical enough to be able to withstand the battles you have to engage in in the NBA.”
Take it FWIW, but do remember that he has coached Coleman, Owens and Carmelo, three ridiculously gifted basketball players…
KJ – who?
Hollinger has never been one to be afraid to eat a bit of crow when need be. Unlike some…
Rich – so basically you want Hollinger to eat crow. He did that in his chat wrap.
Cols, what was I wrong about?
Mallory, you were tremendously and loudly wrong. Being sarcastic at this point isn’t going to help you.
TT FOR THE ALL STAR GAME! DION WAITERS FOR MVP!!!!!!!
It’s going to be hilarious in a few years when someone like Larry Sanders is gonna get paid like DAJ for pretty much blocks alone and Tristan will likely be signing a comparably good deal (even if the money is similar) for a balanced, non-flashy game that yields all-around better results on either end of the floor.
I would like to talk about TTs ceiling. He’s doing things, right now, that most people HOPED he would ONE DAY be able to, and even then he probably wouldn’t make it. The fact that he’s flipped a switch and has suddenly transformed into whatever this is certainly changes his ceiling. It goes from being some sort of defensive stopper/elite rebounder type like the Tyson Chandler of power forwards (this being him reaching his absolute ceiling) into something far, far more interesting. As far as eating crow, the guys I really want eating crow are the ones who earlier this… Read more »
My wife thinks I have a Luke Walton crush, cause I groan about him all game. My favorite stretch was in the third when he had a foul, an airball, and a pass to no one in about 3 minutes time. The fourth quarter was funny too, when the Kings were literally 10 feet off him, daring him to shoot. I like Livingston, and I like him as a glue guy that can play three positions. However, he can’t shoot — not even remotely. He can drive, dunk, pass, defend, rebound, and set up the offense though. Pargo has more… Read more »
Kj
Yep. Reading around these parts you’d think the Cavs can’t draft at all. Except they’ve now put together 3 pretty great picks.
KJ – I’m glad you’re around. I was worried there for a while when you stopped commenting.
Ahhh, an overly defensive Pestak! Now that’s more like it!
Btw, something none of you Dion haters seem to get; rookies (guards esp) don’t shoot well. Period. Kyrie’s was a HUGE exception! Please try and understand this part…
You intimate that Dion did not attack the rim after the first half. That is completely false. You blame Scott but not Kyrie? Curious, to say the least. Kyrie has been over-dribbling all year and has been in hero mode too much esp since Dion was the one tonight to take the shots in the 4th. There is no evidence that Kyrie would’ve passed to Dion no matter where you put him. I ruefully chuckle at how far the goalposts have been moved vis-a-vis Dion. Did tonight’s game give us “hope?” Oh joy! Cuz I was so worried the 2nd… Read more »
I like your point Pelliott. Byron still needs to get kyrie passing the ball more often, but can’t fault him for letting Zeller try. Its not like TT was hurting for more foul either calls at 5.
I believe, as has been mentioned in the past, Byron has a “trial by fire” approach to a lot of his young players. We saw it when he stuck a young lineup on the floor without Kyrie in the 4th quarter a couple times earlier in the year. I think last night’s Zeller covering Cousins was one of those moments. Obviously we don’t have a bruiser on this roster for Zeller to practice against, and he needs to learn how to better avoid getting shoved around down low and bang with guys like Boogie. What better way to learn than… Read more »
Hey Colin….Nice, succinct game wrap-up. Lately, most of your brethren have resorted to gazillion-word blog posts trying to summarize the game, but leaving us poor readers wondering why these mind-numbingly similar losses need analyzed in such laborious detail.
It’s really all pretty simple…the Cavs stink without Andy, and the head coach is on auto-pilot.
Appreciate your directness and brevity.
LOved Dion’s game! He worked very hard. Agree it’s a mystery Zellar on Cousins. But he was getting under his skin last night. I thought for sure he was going to get ejected. The one thing that was disappointing and Campey Russel & Company pointed out was in the last quarter; Kyrie’s refusal (they said refusal) to pass the ball when he was getting double teamed and resulted in 6 turnovers. It didn’t make sense especially when Dion was still out there as hot as he was. Kyrie as wonderful as he is needs to get more comfortable in focusing… Read more »
Tom
A simple everyone who writes for CTB was wrong about Thompson would suffice. Plus Mallory shouldn’t be allowed to comment on Thompson ever again. He was crazily down on Thompson and whined about it in every post and podcast.
Cols – I don’t think you get it. We are writing GAME RECAPS. Covering TRENDS. Podcasting on the prior weeks games. We OBLITERATED CJ Miles when he looked horrible. I won’t speak for others – but the “TT selection” is a very different from “How does TT look” or “Can TT become an effective starter/rotation player”. As such, depending on the topic, the coverage will be different. It wouldn’t have made sense for the Cavs to draft Lilliard last year (Cavs have a PG of the future) but that doesn’t mean if the Cavs HAD drafted Lilliard that he wouldn’t… Read more »
HotSauce – You guy are cracking me up. Have you read anything this blog has produced since mid December when TT started playing well? I expect this nonsense from Cols. But come on, you’re better than that. If you’re trying to get high on vindication…go HARDER. You guys got NOTHING on Rich. What is it you are looking for from “the blog”? “Eat crow?” What like instead of writing glowing praise about TT you’d rather we write “we’re sorry our November/early December coverage of TT reflected his play instead of just ignoring everything that happened and writing about politics or… Read more »
TT is proving many doubters wrong. Waiters has two great games on his resume, and even with that, is shooting 38% from the field and scores about the same amount of points as he has shot attempts. The guy is incredibly erratic, is justifiably not starting, and has gotten worse at rebounding and assists as the season has worn on. By no means do I think he’s a bust, he’s shown a lot of promise and flashes and has some nice ability. But to say he was a good draft pick is highly premature, biased, and presumptuous. It is entirely… Read more »
Yeah, I was thinking, 2nd year player averaging almost 14 ppg, 12 boards (even if it’s been for the past 3-4 weeks, that’s getting beyond a mere aberration) is bordering on star territory. Not just empty rebounds or scoring, too (KRIS HUMPHRIES I’M STARING DIRECTLY AT YOU). And he’s only getting better. With his already excellent team defense he’s becoming the piece we were hoping we’d be getting when Grant drafted him.
@Pete – yeah that’s a pet peeve of mine. Not sure what Tristan’s PER is for the the last month but he’s having the best month of his career. In each month (Nov-> Dec -> Jan) he has improved: FG%, FT%, MIN/g, PTS/g, REB/g, AST/g In January he is averaging 13.8 and 11.8 which is Dwight Howard territory. Granted, this is an 8 game sample. But, he’s only playing 33 minutes a game. If he held those per game averages over a full season (seems reasonable if he starts playing 38 minutes a night) he’d be in some elite company.… Read more »
Hopefully Chris Grant turns out to be as good at free agency as he is the draft. He’s also going to have to evaluate Byron Scott at some point. I don’t think that’s going to turn out well for Scott.
As for CTB. Well they are going to have to reconcile their narrative that Waiters and Thompson were horrible picks with the fact that both are pretty good at basketball somehow.
Spots – You expect CTB to eat crow about an extreme prospect projection that now looks overstated? Ain’t going to happen. Cols – totally agree. It’s clear to me that this team has talent, with TT, Waiters and Irving as a great core. They just have so much to learn about winning, effort, and Defense. Given how young they are, it will happen in due time. If AV comes back healthy for a subset of games this year, I really think the team will quickly jump to .500 ball. They are in so many close games right now and they… Read more »
Christ Grant is good at drafting. Kyrie, TT, and Waiters are all hits.
Equally as infuriating as last nights loss.
I’m just curious as to what Tristan’s PER has been over the past month — I’d guess in the neighborhood of 17-18 but does anyone know? It’s hard to find splits of advanced stats.
TT haters / JV lovers…. Tristan’s got a higher PER than jonas, just saying. He’s slowly climbing his way to the coveted 15 mark too. Might even get it after next game.
“Fantastic” just doesn’t come to mind anymore when I think of upcoming matchups.
Damian Lillard is the only rookie to top Dion’s 33 tonight, and he needed 43 minutes and 25 shots to get it done. Compare that to Dion’s 29 minutes and 18 shots and I think we’ve seen the best rookie scoring night of the season.
Should have drafted Harrison Barnes