Tristan Thompson Has No Ceiling
2013-01-24A peculiar phenomenon of the internet seems to be that nuanced observation and dialogue is… unpopular. Maybe “not popular” would be a better way to put it. It seems as if the quickest way to page views and hyperlink glory is to churn out the most hyperbolic, sensationalist screed possible. In the quest to shout the most ridiculous and extreme views from the mountaintop in order to engender the most snickers, likes, or hates, it becomes impossible to differentiate between parody and actual opinion. Poe’s law makes the line between expressing a strong opinion and baiting trolls increasingly impossible to discern. Unfortunately, there’s no smiley face emoticon that can be slapped on every single mocking sentence, and praise can be dripping with sarcastic derision. So in light of Tristan Thompson Bobblehead Giveaway night tomorrow at the Q, I guess I have to say this without an ounce of irony or shtick: Tristan Thompson’s been pretty good lately.
How good? Since Anderson Varejao has been out of the lineup, TT has put up some very impressive averages: 14.1 points per game, 11.9 rebounds in 35.4 minutes a game. His PER is roughly 17.84 (calculated using linear weights PER). His true shooting percentage is .543, and his defensive rebound rate has been 24%. The most impressive number? He’s shooting .691 from the line in that time! If someone had bet me last year that TT would shoot almost 70% from the line for a solid month, I’d have said, “yeah, and the Lakers won’t make the playoffs.” Kevin called Tristan’s game buttery slickness. I’m calling him poutine. That free throw percentage is pure gravy.
How has Tristan done this? First of all his rebounding has improved dramatically. Tristan’s always been a good offensive rebounder. Before AV left the lineup, TT was rebounding at a rate of 12.9% offensively and 17.8% defensively for a total rebound rate of 15.2%. Since Andy’s injury, Thompson is rebounding at a rate of 14.6 ORB%, 24.0 DRB%, and 19.1 TRB%. Obviously, in Varejao’s absence, there are more rebounds to go around, especially when playing with Luke Walton, but TT’s rebounding is reaching elite levels. 19.1TRB% would be #10 in the league this season. As it stands now, TT is #10 in offensive rebounding this season, even including the time he played with Andy. Raising his defensive rebounding rate an additional 6.2% in Andy’s absence is impressive. That’s a per game average improvement of 4.2 rebounds a game.
It’s not just the rebounding. Canadian Dynamite has become a confident and effective offensive player. As we’ve talked about and Austin Carr has alluded to, Tristan Trevor James Thompson has torn down his offensive game and rebuilt himself as a right hander. Strangely ambidextrous, Thompson has much more touch with the right hand. The left hand shot seems to be flatter, and to have less spin on it. While he still shoots freethrows lefty, his new preferred move seems to be the right handed hook shot in the lane out to about 9 feet, which he’s becoming more and more effective at. Another reason that Tristan has become the ketchup chips of offensive players, is that he rarely takes dumb shots. Tristan is not a jump shooter and he knows it. He rarely takes a jump shot at all. He is much more effective with the hook or flip shot from both sides of the basket, but if he doesn’t have a good look, he’s gotten very good at giving the ball up and not forcing anything. His shot chart speaks volumes.
Thompson has gotten effective at shooting the jump hook, and can go over either shoulder (though I wish he’d go left a bit more to keep the D honest). He has a full on hook as well as a little jump hook push shot that he likes to shoot from the right and left of of the key. He’s also gotten very good at quick dunking guys and has dropped some of the weight he had earlier this season. No longer afraid of getting fouled, TT goes quickly to the bucket and has learned to get to the far side of the rim on dunks to avoid getting blocked. I’m impressed by his ability to be a double digit scorer simply through putbacks, dunks, hook shots, and the occasional dribble drive. Yes, his handle is pretty sweet for a big man, and he’s been impressing with his between the legs crossover. KG turned his head the other night, and TT flew to the rack from the top of the key to earn two freebies. Because of his dribble drive game, defenders can’t completely ignore TT outside of the key. Plus, his free throw form looks better every game. Even if he rarely uses it in games, it’s obvious that the time Thompson spent in the offseason working on his jumper has helped him at the charity stripe tremendously. As can be seen in this highlight real from Portland, it’s obvious he’s working at it between every game, too.
Another evolution of Tristan’s game has been better passing and decision making before Andy’s injury, Thompsons assist rate was 6.1%, his turnovers were 14.6% and his usage was 15.1%. Since the injury he’s bumped them to 7.9 AST%, 10.6 TOV%, and 18.3% Usage. So he’s also getting the ball more. He even had a 5 assist night against Boston. He may never be Bill (or even Luke) Walton, but he’s no longer Yinka Dare.
On the other side of the ball, the Cavs defense is (still) such a mess that it’s really hard to grade him. Tristan passes the eye test, in that he seems to get in good position and be a decent one on one defender. He’s certainly better than his replacements, and has been all season. 82games ranks him as helping the Cavs D give up 7 less points per hundred possessions, and score an additional 4.2 per 100 possessions than his subfor a net rate of +11.2 for the season. This is more an indictment of Tristan’s really bad replacements though. Recently, TT held LaMarcus Aldridge and Paul Millsap below their averages and helped limit KG to 5-13 shooting. but he definitely has room for improvement here. Furthermore Tristan’s blocks are down drastically this year from last year, and he hasn’t been any better in Andy’s absence. His block rate has dropped in half from 3.3% to 1.7%. The increase in rebounding has benefited, but it would be nice if he could regain some of the aggressiveness on help defense that he had in his rookie year, while still leaving behind the wild abandon that got him consistently out of position.
The real question is: where can Tristan go from here? Tristan’s rapid improvement has been eye opening. It’s like he hired Mark Whalberg’s post Planet of the Apes acting coach to develop his post game. That serviceable post game was developed in a season and a half after Jay Bilas said on draft night,“he needs to learn how to play and how to score.” Can Thompson keep developing? One good thing is that he seems to add one skill at a time. If TT can master the hook shot, he can graduate to learning how to use the glass. He’s still not very good at this, but has gotten better at layups off the square. If he can figure that out, he can start learning how to dunk one handed, which will allow TT to finish at some better angles and let him wait to expose the ball on the flush. With those abilities and the little flip shot which I’ve seen a few times, Tristan can develop a counter off the hook: an up an under or a turn and face power move/step through/drop step. That should help him on the block. In the next couple years if he can develop a jumper even out to 15 feet, he could really be something.
Pre-season, I said that Tristan’s ceiling may be a slightly better on offense Ben Wallace. I’m revising that. His ceiling is unknown at this point. According to a comment Kevin made yesterday, “In the last ten years, the guys to average 15 & 12 and 50% fg are Duncan, Garnett, Howard, Blake Griffin and Zach Randolph (once).” Tristan is getting close to this in his last month and simple improvements seem possible. Let’s hope he can keep it up. TT’s ability to conjure dramatic improvement in season is a rare commodity. In looking at his game, I’m not sure I can figure out a player to compare him to. Name me a long armed left handed center in a power forward’s body who scored mostly out of the post, had a face-up game with no jump shot, could put up 12 boards a game, and was still a decent defender? Maybe Tristan’s a southpaw Dennis Rodman. This much is true: the fumbling and hesitant player TT was at the beginning of the season, when he was still a rookie, no longer exists. Tristan has achieved the rare feat of mid-season metamorphosis.
What I like most about Tristan is his demeanor on and off the court. He seems affable, well spoken, and genuinely funny. I absolutely love this video for TT’s induction into the bobblehead hall of fame, and the fact that TT’s taken on childhood epilepsy as part of his charity work. Furthermore, if Fox Sports is to be believed, Tristan was leading the huddles in the game against the Celtics. He seems one of the few Cavs truly committed to defense on every play, and he plays with an energy that is infectious. No snark — Canadian Dynamite has become one of my favorite Cavaliers.
P.S. I completely forgot to mention TT’s rapidly developing pick and roll chemistry with Kyrie, and the fact that he consistently runs the floor: two more gold stars in his favor, and the source of a few more buckets a game. That is all. Let the love fest continue.
P.P.S According to commenter, LaughingCavs, Tristan’s PER is actually 18.5 since Andy’s quad tear (linear weights PER is a rough PER approximation, and tends to drift by a point or so). He also included this great graph which tracks Tristan’s PER per (offensive) possession from the 500th (offensive) possession of the season onward. TT is tracking over 20 in the month of January. Exciting stuff.
Ok. I will honestly stop reading if this becomes a we want LBJ back blog. However if this gets serious movement and I think it will. I am thinking about starting a group thats aim is to prevent LBJ’s return. The target Gilbert and the slogan don’t kiss the ring, also maybe a billboard reading “Et tu Gilbert.” I think that this could actually help prevent this too, if LBJ knows that he will have a small but consistent and loud group of hecklers never giving him peace even at home maybe it will give him pause. Also Using the… Read more »
KJ, in what way have you been “right” about Dion? And how is expecting this kind of improvement mid season from TT not homerism? I mean, its awesome that he’s done it, but what he’s done mid season is extremely rare. I doubt Byron would have expected it, much less the majority of basketball watchers. And seriously, what are you right about with Dion? I mean the guy can get to the hole, but a big part of that is because he takes a ton of terrible jump shots to keep defenses from gaurding the lane, and he’s not good… Read more »
Love TT’s development, but I would temper the statistical enthusiasm a bit. His numbers are in part propped up by the fact that he’s the only legit big on the roster. Andy returning, Zellers improvement, and the possible drafting of another big are going to take a bite out of his rebounding especially.
Still, Im rally optimistic about Tristan, and his tremendous intangibles. So many guys waste a ton of talent because they just never seem tp learn how to go hard at all times. JJ being a prime example…
Cols, It is not necessarily wise to ignore what people are saying about the next draft. After the TT pick, I plan to trust Grant and his people to thoroughly evaluate the potential picks and select as good of a player as possible. If he decides that the people who are bashing the class are accurate, I wouldn’t be surprised to see him include those picks bundled in a trade. Either way, I’m confident that the Cavs will have thought through the process extensively. Now that TT has turned a corner in his development along with Kyrie and a good… Read more »
Can we block commenters? If not, move on Cols…. sigh. How old are you anyway?
@ Cols
I’m not buying into the narrative that this upcoming draft class is terrible.
But if other GMs believe this draft is weak, maybe we can pounce and trade up for a top 2 pick.
Vesus
They kept saying that about the Irving draft as well. I remember listening to Bill Simmons and Chad Ford discuss the lack of talent in that draft. The Cavs ended up with Irving and Thompson. That’s pretty good.
So I think we should ignore the people who say this draft sucks.
@ Tom
People keep saying this draft is bereft of talent, so maybe the Cavs could trade up and get Noel? Could be the defensive monster / finisher we need at Center.
Of course, if we don’t start winning more we may not have to trade up for him.
@ Tom I think that team would work better with Kyrie doing most of the ball handling and Lebron playing at the 4 with Tristan as a small 5. Try keeping up with that small lineup. Lebron always wanted us to draft Chris Paul, now he will have a chance to come home and play with the next best thing. Speaking to Cavs fans in general: I don’t care how much you hate Lebron (and his failure against Dallas remains one of my best sports memories ever), but you have to be intrigued at the idea of Lebron and Kyrie… Read more »
Vesus – the Cleveland MAVS were a lot of fun weren’t they? I actually rooted FOR Deshawn Stevenson. Wow….
@ Tom You’re welcome. What I found interesting in that podcast was that Brian was saying the Cavs need to bring in one big name player to entice LeBron to come back. If that’s actually what they are trying to do, that means before the trade deadline of next season. Basically, in one calendar year. I’m trying to picture who that might be. I’d like to see them bring in Al Jefferson. I think he fits well next to TT. It would allow Andy to come off the bench and play less minutes. Plus, it would allow the Cavs to… Read more »
Well, if the Cavs seriously think they can lure LeBron back at SF then the biggest glaring need is, yep, center. Not sure how much someone like Jefferson is required. I’d prefer a beast defensive player. Honestly, that team you just trotted at has so much talent – it’d really just be about the coaching/fit. With or without LeBron – I think Kyrie is going to need to learn how to play with Dion. Both of them right now are most effective with the ball in their hands to start an offensive possession. Actually, I noticed recently that Kyrie is… Read more »
Brian
I’ll move on when Mallory says he was completely wrong about everything for the first 3 months of the season. Deal?
As for Kyrie/Lebron. Yes please. That would be awesome.
Kyrie/Lebron/TT in 2015 > Wade/Lebron/Bosh in 2012
Wow Vesus – that might…be right…actually. I dunno though. Depends on if Kyrie can learn to play off the ball. Right now he can’t (won’t)
Cols, ENOUGH. If you dislike and disagree with the OPINIONS on most given days of CTB writers, especially Mallory (who’s one of my favorites, but to each his own) why waste your time reading and antagonizing the UNPAID but (in my opinion) thoughtful, talented and free-thinking writers of this blog because they don’t share your viewpoint on everything? No CTB writer need apologize for a damn thing. It’s fine to disagree, Cols. It’s not OK to beat a dead horse until it’s pulpy. Want to comment? Fine. But at some point, could you agree to disagree and move on …… Read more »
Tom
Your narrative was dumb. It was dumb to act like Thompson was doomed because he wasn’t playing up to whatever standards you wanted him too. No one “knew” that he was going to be this good, but a lot of people were preaching patience and the like while you guys wrote columns and bashed him as much as possible.
Just give the credit to Kj where it is due and take responsiblity for being wrong.
Haters gon’ hate. We netted a national NBA journalist in our web of lies. What’s this sudden surge of power I feel….It’s…intoxicating.
TT now a big man to watch according to Doolittle’s Big Man Barometer
WFNY posted an article a few months back about why we watch sports. I forget most of the detail but the key message was “if the only reason you are watching sports is to watch your team win a championship, you are going to be a very unhappy sports fan.” Remember how hard it is to win a championship. Miami, with arguably 3 of the top 10 players, still needed a good amount of luck to get past the Pacers & Celtics. The Yankees, with an all-star ridden lineup, haven’t won in years. The point is, there is pleny to… Read more »
For those of you that are interested, Brian Windhorst did a podcast WKNR, and does talk about the Cavs for a bit.
http://www.stationcaster.com/player_skinned.php?s=70&c=476&f=1004181
Cody – awesome. Thanks for sharing.
Incredible segment on Tristan.
Windy: it’s been “a revelation” […] “Cavs really didn’t know if they could build around Tristan 6 weeks ago…..Now they do”
how much respect do you [the 3-5 of you] have for CtB now that you know we even got WINDY in on our “narrative”
Also – for Dani and the rest of the “Anderson Varejao is injury prone” folk: Windhorst: “it’s a real freak occurance” “Doctor’s don’t always know where it comes from. There’s a hundred different causes.” “I know people are frustrated – but…it’s an injury I’ve never heard of. I’ve never heard of a quadricepts split. It’s remarkably unfortunate. I don’t see any reason why he shouldn’t be able to get past this and be fine next season. He’s gone through a couple lost years – not because of conditioning or anything else. It’s because of stuff he can’t control” [ankle injury… Read more »
Off-topic a little, but I love how people on a website about a specific sports team use the word “homer” as if it’s an insult. Yes, I’m a homer. I openly root for the Cavs. So do all of you. It’s ok. When someone calls you a homer, just laugh because it’s such a stupid “insult” in the first place.
Rich – you’re certainly not a homer when it comes to C.J. Miles
@ Kj
What exactly are you seeing from Gee that makes you think his defense is sliding? He held D. Lillard w/o a fg for 3 quarters and Paul Pierce only went 3-15.
KJ – I’m engaging you not to argue, but for serious discourse, so lets keep this purely about the team. At the beginning of the season, Tristan’s offense was cringe-worthy. His shots were getting blocked at an ALARMING rate and he seemed lost a lot. Not the case now, but it was then. Waiters has shown explosiveness, yes, but the guy also has horrible shot selection. How correctable a problem that is is definitely debatable – no certainties with guys who have tendencies to take the type of awful shots he’s shown a penchant for. Now, take note I’m not… Read more »
Hey KyrieSwIrving, by no rational definition am I a “homer.” What I have been is right about TT and Dion. PUBLICLY. Just the opposite of the writers you so desperately want to shield from accountability. I would also point out how FEW articles there have been on players on the Cavs who I think deserve criticism! This point seems completely to be missed! I warned for weeks after the draft not to get too excited about Zeller. He has been terrible in a way neither TT or Dion have arguably EVER been and his numbers merely come from playing a… Read more »
jherm
The only thing that Andy has to do with TT’s development is that he got injured.
@ Tom
I hear you. It must be what Lakers fans are going through now.
Tom – you nalied it about the LBJ era. After like his 2nd season the media wouldnt just let us enjoy him. Anyway, that ship has sailed.
TT is really surprising the world (and Grant is looking like a genious). Im sure Andy has alot to do with that – perfect example of what a big motor and work ethic can do for you. Now if Waiters can learn to shoot then we got something here :)
grover
Player development is exactly what you should care about this year, not wins and losses. It’s part of the reason why this blog was so hard to read in November and December. It was obvious to everyone who doesn’t write for the blog that the players were improving.
By the way, in terms of watching the Cavs- we’re only like 9 games out of a playoff spot. YOU’VE GOT TO BELIEVE. I’m not joking.
A great analogy Tom. It made me realize- I’m enjoying watching regular season basketball for the first time in a decade. When you are championship-focused, the regular season becomes almost irrelevent….you’re just hoping you get a decent seed, and none of your key guys get hurt. It’s just an incubation period for the playoffs- the games that matter. Now, because there is no end-goal like that, it’s more relaxing. Interesting.
But again….IS THAT GOOD OR BAD? I STILL CAN’T TELL!!!!
grover – I think it’s fine. Cavs aren’t on the clock yet. They’re not all-in either. That day is coming – and the “kyrie wants to play with Kevin Love in LA with Kobe” stories are right around the corner. But I know to block it all out this time.
Great article! Makes me realize how thankful I am to be watching the evolution of TT and KI, instead of of Derrick Williams and Brandon Knight.
While Tristan’s blocks may be down, Synergy is a big fan of his D: He ranks 34th overall in the NBA, and 18th in guarding isolation plays.
Even more amazingly, albeit in a rather small sample size (44 plays) Tristan ranks 33rd overall in isolation plays on offense! Not post ups, to clarify, these are plays where he takes his defender off the dribble. Considering he’s not a threat to shoot the jumper, this really says something about his handle and finishing ability.
@ Grover
I know what you mean. I think it’s fine for now. This season was never really about getting a low playoff seed. It would have been nice, but it wasn’t the goal. It was more about player development and positioning for the future in terms of cap space and draft picks. It looks like they’ve accomplished both.
As for the rest of the season, I’d like to see: TT continue to progress, perimeter defense become tighter, and the new guys become valuable rotation players. Reasonable goals, I think.
Yeah, Mallory, I think you should go on Oprah to apologize to the nation. I want to see tears.
Mallory, still not able to say you were wrong?
Good article Nate.
Oh, and TV63….you can’t comment on the unhealthiest food ever until you’ve been to the Minnesota State Fair. Deep-fried Twinkies, anyone?
Personally, I don’t think the Ben Wallace comparison is appropriate. Big Ben, while obviously an offensive liability, was a one-of-a-kind defensive intimdator. He was a Gorilla in a tank-top. Tristan will never average 15 boards/2 steals/3 blocks. He’s just a different type of player. However, I’ll through this one out there- I think his ceiling could be Karl Malone without a jump shot. Somewhere like 17pts/12reb and strong effort every night, developing into a leader. He is lately showing a court awareness that I didn’t think he had. He’s improving in multiple facets of the game all at once- and… Read more »
grover – I’m there too, only I do care about team cohesiveness – semblance of an offense – defensive identity. But I fully expect them to lose most games. So every win is a pleasant surprise. It’s fun. The LeBron era Cavs were so anxiety-ridden. Winning wasn’t enough. Sometimes blowouts weren’t enough. It was always championship or bust – and any slip ups generated a huge amount of “LeBron is a choker – the Cavs are LeBron and a bunch of d-leaguers” while huge winning streaks were “haha – enjoy watching LeBron in a Knicks uniform in 2 years”. It… Read more »
Hot Sauce, it would be cool if you stopped asking for mea culpa from writers who make their opinions public and are going to be wrong as much as they are right when making such hard projections. If it was so easy their wouldn’t be busts or steals in the draft. They have praised TTs improvements on a game by game basis, admitting pleasant surprise, admitting to having bad projected ceilings in the past, and are not claiming to have told anyone so. Saying sorry for being wrong about a projection is completely stupid as its nothing to be sorry… Read more »
Great article. Have always thought TT’s work ethic, athleticism, and long arms were his biggest assets. His recent developments are a direct result of all three. Everyone on the team is wowed by his work ethic, so the sky really is the limit for this kid. My guess, though, is that there will be some more bumps in the road where he regresses. In the event that happens, hopefully we can all be patient and continue to appreciate this man’s true talents: character, work ethic, drive, etc. Never bet against those things when they are coupled with a nice helping… Read more »
@ Matt
TT would be up for a second contract the same time Kyrie is (2016-17), since they were both first round picks.
Awesome article. I agree that defenses will start to account for him and things could get rough for him again for awhile. Still, have to love what we have seen. Carter, I know exactly what jump shot you are talking about haha.
Tristan’s season trajectory, creepin on ah come up:
http://i.imgur.com/cVomFpO.jpg
nice article. some questions that hopefully will not be taken as a joke. when TT is up for a second contract what do you think is arket value for him based on his current trend and high end projections? Obviously Kyrie will get the 5 year max. But if TT puts up 15 pts 12 boards, 2-3 assists, a steal and a block, do you think that would complicate the scenarior for grant? finally, if TT dropped those numbers, i would be more than overjoyed but think it might be a bit ambitious cavs fan biased on my part. have… Read more »
Also, is it ridiculous that I remember that one jumper the furthest to the right on the shot chart? I was so excited and shocked when it happened, I think it just implanted in my memory.
Using play-by-play data and Hollinger’s true formula, Tristan’s PER is 18.5 since Varejao left. For the month of January it’s even higher, around 20.
Damned Bleacher Report and its anti-Tristan conspiracies.
Kevin, I don’t think that Nate was using that as a negative “ceiling” but just as a projected based on skill sets. I think the point is that Tristan has changed his game, and the way he plays it, and as a result, Ben Wallace, as great as he was, doesn’t seem to be the right fit.
Probably should’ve looked up how to spell pouting before commenting. Oh well – its early.
PS – had to make a one day stop in CLE – snagged a bunch of Hopslam. Tried one yesterday – WOW! Definitely right up there with the best double IPAs.
Speaking of which, expect a new brews and bruises in the next week or so.
Wait TV63, you’ve never tried Putin? It’s amazing. Delicious, heartburn inducing, glorious. Yum
I’m sad I missed the last game because it sounded like a fun look into what TT is really capable of. Love love love what I’ve been seeing from him recently (as I’m sure everyone else does). His improvement from the beginning of the season to now is amazing. It’ll be really interesting to see where he goes from here, especially when teams start figuring out that they should probably start accounting for him on the court.
That has got to be the unhealthiest food I’ve ever seen. Gravy on cheese curds and french fries. Nooooo.
After this comment, I am banning myself from the comment section today. Two things; first, the author of this article is Nate Smith. His middle name is not “the”, nor is his first or last name “Cavs” or “Blog”. I probably can’t recollect everything that Nate has written and said here, but generally I think his vantage point towards Tristan has been relatively fair and forward looking. Second, whether it was ever an appropriate ceiling or not, a “slightly better on offense Ben Wallace” is a GREAT ceiling. Wallace was a four-time DPOY and five-time first-team all defense. I actually… Read more »