Trade Kyrie! Zeller is the Future! SAS 96, CLE 95
2013-02-13
Tyler Zeller, future MVP and franchise star.
Kyrie Irving was horrendous, the Cavaliers played the best team in the NBA…and somehow, they only lost to the Spurs by a single point. How on Earth did that happen? Let us delve into the details.
First Half:
Kyrie bricked a deep three to start the game, and it was all downhill from there for him. In a rare turn of events, though, just about every other Cavalier was productive and efficient in the first half. The Cavs looked energetic on defense for once, running around and trapping like demons. Alonzo Gee got a few breakaway dunks, and Tyler Zeller simply looked like a different player from the indolent young man who’s been missing layups and clanking 17-footers all year. And Dion BALLED OUT. Slicing and dicing through the Spurs defense, dumping passes off to open big men, this was the player Chris Grant envisioned when he drafted the young sixth man from Syracuse. The second unit stepped up as well. Luke did Waltonian stuff (pass well, defend poorly) while Shaun Livingston nailed that funky turnaround jumper a few times. Kyrie Irving simply sucked. The only facet of the game he contributed in was distribtion. He fed the big men for some easy buckets, and found C.J. Miles on a beautiful cut (layup was blown). But man, was his defense awful. Tony Parker simply ran by Kyrie to the hoop, over and over and over again. Not to mention no. 2 couldn’t hit a shot to save his life. Still, a positive half for the Cavs. It ended with an eight-point lead! CLE 54, SAS 46.
Second Half:
Ugly start for the Cavs in the third quarter. They missed a lot of shots, and the Spurs did all the things Gregg Popovich asked them to do. And he’s a genius, so that generally works out well for them. Tony Parker simply ravaged the Cavaliers tonight. If it weren’t for Dion Waiters, this game might have been over before the fourth quarter started. He dropped 10 in the third- all on drives- and was awesome. Kyrie continued to be awful on defense and offense. Then the fourth quarter came, and Cavaliers Nation readied themselves for the entrance of the second unit, the mighty group known as the Herculoids. For all the flak Marreese Speights gets about only shooting jumpers, the man has some great second jump-ability when offensive rebounding. He just hops around until the ball gets in the hoop. The offense was sub-par, but the defense was great. Shaun Livingston is worlds apart from Kyrie when it comes to man-up D. The game went back and forth in the fourth, and when Kyrie hit a pair at the line (giving him a whopping six points on the night!), the Cavs were up 93-90. And then Gary Neal hit an absolute dagger, tying the game. He’s an assassin. Kyrie had a big steal, setting the Cavs up with a chance to take the lead. He wisely got out of the way as Dion calmly drained a 22-footer for the two-point lead. And then the next possession….ugh. An AWFUL decision by Dion to over-help on Tony Parker penetration led to a wide-open Kawhi Leonard corner three….money. With two seconds left, Kyrie managed to slip, commit a carrying violation (no call) and miss a one-handed, falling-down “jumper.” Ballgame. SAS 96, CLE 95.
Notes:
-Maybe the worst game of Kyrie Irving’s young career. I can’t remember him ever looking this out of sorts on offense. 2-15 from the field, six points, five fouls. Sadly, we’re all used to seeing him looks this out of sorts on defense. Tony Parker is a great point guard, but he went to town on Kyrie tonight. Utter decimation.
-Tyler Zeller: 16 points, nine rebounds, four assists, one block, and fantastic defense on Tim Duncan. Timmy D was helpless most of the night, as Zeller’s length and speed were the perfect remedy to the Big Fundamental’s collection of slow hooks and turnaround jumpers.
-Dion was sublime. If he starts to play like this on a regular basis, the rest of the NBA had better watch out. He is an absolute terror on offense when he decides to be aggressive, and is a very solid passer. A lot of his attributes as a player remind me of Monta Ellis, which is not necessarily a negative comparison, and certainly not one that should bother Cavs fans. A stronger Monta Ellis with a higher basketball IQ would be a force to be reckoned with.
-Ideal Alonzo game. Seven points on five shots, and a few rim-rattling dunks.
-The bench as a whole was very solid. C.J. Miles and Shaun Livingston in particular played very well. Speights shot a little poorly. Wayne Ellington was only OK, and is losing ground in the battle for the official “mediocre three-point gunner who only sorta plays defense and only drives once a game” title to Miles.
-Tony Parker PUT DA TEAM ON HIS BACK.
-The Spurs are a great team, and a one-point loss to them is the definition of a moral victory for a team as young and thin as the Cavs.
P.S.
Does this Nerlens Noel injury make him more likely to fall to the Cavs?
Kyrieswirving- he is shooting that well this year. He was in the low 20’s last season. His actual shot doesn’t seem mechanically sound and in watching him play several times the last two years, I’ve never seen him standout in the way you’d like a lottery pick stand out. I just don’t see him being elite at any phase of the game. I think he’ll be a good player but i’m hoping for a cornerstone for the cavs and I see porter as important role player caliber guy (like tayshaun prince).
When did people decide Otto doesn’t have a jump shot? I admittedly haven’t seen him play much, but he’s hitting 45% from 3 taking 2.5 a game, isn’t that a Jump shot?
And Rondo was an important piece to the Celtics championship, but there is no way you are convincing me (or almost anyone outside of rondo’s mother, and probably not even her) that he was the most valuable or best player on the 07-08 Celtics.
Cavs_All_Day, the spurs would have beaten the cavs that year even if Parker didn’t play, and Duncan had a better season for the team that year (even though the media and most stats ignore defense), Parker was just hot that series. Tim Duncan outscored parker on the season and in the postseason, averaged 10+ boards, and was clearly the best defender on the team by a decent margin. No one would have looked at their overall seasons and thought parker was more important than Duncan. Billups was debatably the best player on that Piston’s team, and I’d personally give it… Read more »
Trade Irving? Your an idiot. How many games over 25 points has Zeller ever had? Your just an idiot. I bet you don;t thing its a good idea for Lebron to come back either. Fool.
Cosign Otto Porter, been hoping we get him since day one. High IQ, tools to be a long, bothersome defender and glue guy. I like Noel too, would be ecstatic if we could wheel and deal for both…
Billups was the Pistons best player during their title runs, Tony Parker was the Finals MVP after obliterating Mike Browns defense in 07, and Jason Kidd would have hung 2 banners n NJ is it weren’t for that Shaq character. Just sayin’
I remember the IDEA of this game, but wow, re-reading the box score is incredible. The Celtics had EIGHTEEN STEALS. (!!!)
Anyways, Rondo was pretty huge against LAL in 2008.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200806170BOS.html
Totally co-sign Grover on Otto Porter. Been clamoring for him since day 1.
Also, Billups was the best player on the Pistons during their titles, Tony Parker was a Finals MVP after obliterating tha Cavs in 07, and Jason Kidd would have gotten two ‘chips in NJ if it weren’t for Shaq. Just sayin’
Saying the defense sucks over and over and over again is not analysis. The Cavs are in a fine position. They are progressing exactly how you would want a team in it’s 2nd year of rebuilding to progress.
Sure you can nitpick, and that’s fine. But we should be very happy with the way things are going.
Kyrie struggled but he’ll learn and grow from it. The next evolution of his game is impacting the game when his shot isn’t going down, and losses like this will push him to get there. Dion was spectacular and games will get him James Harden comparisons. He’s so confident that once he grasps how to score in the flow of the game (he’s made huge strides already), and the veteran scorer tricks he’ll be a guy capable of taking over on any given night. The Kobe and Lebron comparisons aren’t fair, but we don’t need Dion to be that guy.… Read more »
I’m glad this blog attempts analysis instead of just telling us that everything will be fine, and that Chris Grant and Bryon Scott are flawless. Otherwise there’d be nothing much to read. Also appreciate the debate about Speights in the earlier post. I liked how Dani didn’t resort to saying Speights was Mallory’s BFF. That’s a good example of how you can disagree without being an _________.
Kevin
I know you are trying to be funny or make a point of some sort, but really what is wrong with that attitude? The team seems to be on the correct path to winning. They have drafted well, the players are developing, they are even winning a bit now.
So yeah, the team is doing fine.
The team is doing fine. Stop worrying.
Things I am not worried at all about: Cavs defense
Young teams, etc. etc. etc. I’m as tired of saying this as I am tired of reading about the Cavs defense over and over and over again.
Regardless of his position, Kyrie has more often than not in his short NBA career, been a killer (so he had a bad game, it happens). He was also the BPA of his draft, and TT is proving to be one of the next BPAs. Dion is looking more and more like the player CG thought he’d get. You can only take what’s out there and available at any given time either in the draft or in free agency. All you can hope for is a shrewd judge of talent for a GM and an owner who will spare no… Read more »
Nice summary grover. Yes, you can win with a pg as your best player, but recently, for whatever reason, it has been rare. And the hand-check rules that have made this the “PG’s league” I hear so much about, have had no effect on PGs taking over the playoffs. Kyrie could be trancendant, and could very well be the best player on a championship team (no one has said otherwise so stop fanning flames cols) but it is erroneous to say the cavs have already locked up the most important position with Kyrie. Its basketball, its a team sport, its… Read more »
I totally agree with Mallory/Swirving & others on the positional debate. I laugh every time I hear/read “It’s a PG league now”, when none of the top point guards have won titles (or really even come close). As great as some of these guys are- Kyrie included- when you get deep into the playoffs and “gotta get that bucket”, it’s just too easy to put one of the top lockdown defenders on them and crowd the lane, which simultaneously makes it difficult to either drive or take a jumper. Their lack of size works against them. The size/flexibility/versatility ratio is… Read more »
Haha funny that some thought the title was serious… I liked it
Here’s to hoping Nerlens Noel falls to Cleveland at whatever pick they have.
Agree 100% Cody(aka scuzz) Scott needs to get after him on this problem. Irving as great as he can be is not above or exempt from Scott’s discipline. It just wasn’t his night and trusting his team mates is key when that happens. It won’t be the first time and it won’t be the last for Kyrie. He just needs to get mentally prepared and pass it.
Just wanted to point out that I have no problem with them getting LeBron. Just that there are other ways of building a team.
Well Mallory, if you want your team to have the best SF/SG swing position guy then you have to get LeBron. Otherwise you have to build a team a different way.
Pistons with Isaiah, Lakers with Magic. Both multiple championship teams who’s best player was a PG.
Regarding the game’s final play, I haven’t watched it since it happened live, but my recollection is that Kyrie wasn’t the first option off the inbounds. I’d have to watch it again, but I remember thinking that Gee (the inbounds man) was trying to get the ball to Dion, who was covered. He then passed to Kyrie.
This idea that you won’t win a championship if your best player is a PG is bunk. For the millionth time, you don’t have to win the same way that other teams have won in the past.
I’m with Grover. Otto Porter looks like the total package every time I’ve watched him this year & I feel like the Cavs would be a perfect (and realistic) landing spot for him.
I could tell at player introductions that Zeller had a look about him. I think it was because Scott had the confidence to match him up with Duncan which in turn gave Zeller confidence. Also it appears they have finally given Zeller the goahead to leak out for a fast break instead of crashing the boards.I was chatting with a friend over skype, when Dion hit the goahead bucket I was screaming “We got two closers, we got two closers” he was like what are you talking about. I’m like Dion just gave us the lead. He wasn’t even watching… Read more »
I still think you have got to have two good or one great big man. Every champion I can think of was able to protect the rim, whether it was Lebron (playing like a PF)/Bosh, KG, Odom/Pau/Bynum, Tyson/Dirk, Duncan, Shaq, Wallace/Sheed, you gotta be able to play both offense and defense in the paint to win the big prize.
Mallory –
Definitely agree with you on the most important position being the SF/SG, though I would go further and just say the SF position is. By its very nature it is the most versatile position and having a stud there is the most beneficial to a team in today’s game. I will say though that having a stud PG and just a lockdown SF that can hit some threes would work (it’s kind of what the Spurs have). Which is why if the Cavs fall out of the top 5 of the draft I want Otto Porter.
SwIrving –
The PG/Most Important Position conversation is one I have with the other bloggers often. I’m of the strong belief that the SF/SG swing position is and will probably always be the most important position to a championship team. This isn’t to say, like you point out, a PG can’t be the featured star on a championship team, but I definitely think it helps to have the best swing on the floor. Because of the versatility of the position and the height:strength ratio, it’s often the position that makes the most impact consistently.
This is probably the worst I’ve ever seen Kyrie look. I think he’s tired an his ankle has to be bothering him, but to tell the truth the reason this game looked so bad is because of how much he has spoiled us with amazing play for his first season and a half. Dude’s a 20 year old all-star I’m not worried about him at all. I love what I’m seeing out of Dion. He’s attacking the rim more and finishing much better than he did early in the season. Once he can get to the line more consistently he’ll… Read more »
I’m glad Noel got hurt (as it pertains to the Cavs), as I’m not as high on his ceiling as most. This should guarantee that if we land a top-three pick we won’t take him, which is a good thing. If Noel is available at 7-8 (where Cavs might end up), maybe not a bad risk/reward selection. Since he’s a long-term project regardless, production next year wouldn’t have been expected….so what if he misses half/most of the season as long as he recovers fully. However, I’d only entertain Noel if Otto Porter is off the board. He should be the… Read more »
A couple of points: – Overall, I agree with Luis. There are positives that can be taken out of this game. It’s a shame that they didn’t win, but I’m not upset about the game. – Dion played great tonight. I was impressed by how well he finished at the rim. He’s made huge strides from the start of the season. His last shot was great. He just left a little too much time on the clock. Unfortunate, but it happens. – End of quarter play was better. They didn’t allow the Spurs any mini-runs. About Kyrie: His ankle was… Read more »
He’ll certainly need to get better, get some help, and learn to rely on his help to be that Finals MVP he has the potential to be.
Officiating wasn’t any worse than a typical NBA game. I was at the game and it was pretty awesome when Dion hit that shot with 9.5 left and was mean mugging. Kyrie, being cold as hell, needed to defer the last shot to Dion. It was a bit rediculous that he didn’t, he’s young but the sooner he stops playing hero ball the better. Kevin and others, the title is clearly sarcasm, chill out. And the PG is certainly the most overrated position at basketball. Yes, its definitely important, but who was the last even All-star level point gaurd to… Read more »
Fun game. Love what I’m seeing from Waiters. Zeller too!
Mallory’s BFF, Speights shot terribly for the 3rd straight game. What is he these last 3 games, 6-36 or something?
Game loss not due to Waiters totally. Waiters and Zeller had a great game! Waiters worked so hard and wanted badly to be THAT GUY to win it at the end. He almost did! He was so excited after that clutch shot and allowed himself for such a brief nanosecond to be star struck by it (like a rookie would) that he left his guard down just for a ever split second and Parker’s dagger eyes zoomed right at Waiters like a cobra and capitalized on that vulneribility and struck the deadly pass to the waiting Leonard for the 3.… Read more »
Game loss not due to Waiters totally. Waiters and Zeller had a great game! Waiters worked so hard and wanted badly to be THAT GUY to win it at the end. He almost did! He was so excited after that clutch shot and allowed himself for such a brief nanosecond to be star struck by it (like a rookie would) that he left his guard down just for a ever split second and Parker’s dagger eyes zoomed right at Waiters like a cobra and capitalized on that vulneribility and struck the deadly pass to the waiting Leonard for the 3.… Read more »
I haven’t watched the game yet but looking at the play by play, I found it interesting that Byron subbed Gee and Livingston in for CJ and Kyrie for the last defensive possession of the game.
Did that have more to do with the fact that Kyrie is bad at defense? Or because he had 5 fouls? My guess is probably a bit both.
Who knows, if Kyrie is on Parker on their last play, maybe they score quicker and we have an extra second or two to work with. (kidding)
Really wish he gave Waiters that last look especially after that big time shot with 9.5 left. Just adds another element to the team and confidence/growth amongst our other players, especially ones who will be seeing a lot of big shot moments throughout our time.
This was a great game with an unfortunate ending. The Spurs completely destroyed the bulls WITHOUT their big 3 and with us it came down to a late clutch shot. The rest of our players stepped up when Kyrie was having an off night and that is what I take most from this game. Dion stepped up big and now Kyrie is aware that he has that go to guy on his team and not everything has to fall on his shoulders. Great game from Zeller as well.
Anyone bashing Byron or the team after this loss is plain crazy.
I agree with Nate. This is the 3rd straight game Kyrie played hero ball and it has not worked. He took some awful shots tonight.
Btw, the officiating was terrible again. Cavs basically lose 8 points a game due to not getting calls and getting bulk rap calks against them. Night in and night out…
Glad to see Tyler show something. Finally. He played BIG finally.
Dion is who I said he was since summer league. I enjoy all of the haters scrambling harder and harder with each passing game to try and be down on Dion. Comical…
C’mon Dani with the ridiculous title., even from you. Kyrie has done this before when he tries to grind out playing with an injury. His performance suffers thus drags the team down. WOuld rather he just rest and heal. He was awful and the fact he didn’t run well says alot. But you have to be impressed our Cavs didn’t really need him tonight. WHo would have thought that? ? How can you say in one breath oh the bench was solid and tear apart 3 of the 3 players on that bench. Again this was against a very good… Read more »
the most important position in basketball is you’re point gaurd. We have the youngest best point guard in the game and one of the top players in the game in pg kyrie irving. He is young,second year player. He will learn ,improve,grow and just get better play by play,day by day,and year by year. you do not trade thi kind of player away.
Dr B – I think pelliott is being positive (hard to tell with the caps). Watched a little but, man, did KI look exhausted. I am starting to really like this ragtag bunch. Need a stud at the 3, a battleship for the post & keep the Herculoids,,, this could get real fun real fast.
p.s. I am so confused – we want the Lakers to barely scrape into the playoffs, so we get their pick just outside the lottery?
And can we use all these #2’s to stock up on some guys to stash in Europe?
@pelliott – Do you WATCH the games? Duder, we are rebuilding. we’re gonna lose plenty of close games. When our best player has a horrid game and we still give the Spurs hell, that is a positive. Imagine if a healthy Andy V was playing? We would’ve won easily. I for one think this roster (+Andy) is a helluva core. I also think that Andy’s injury has helped the development of Zeller & Tristan immensely. Optimistic as ever…
Dr. B
HOLY CRAP EVERYONE WE’RE 16-37 AND WE SHOULD JUST BE EXCITED WE WERE IN THE GAME AGAINST THE FUCKING SPURS STOP OVERREACTING
Tyler’s aggressiveness was apparent from the opening of the game. He not only played Duncan well, he also played great team defense. Yeah, there was one time he watched while Splitter snuck inside him, but overall Tyler Zeller was the best thing the Cavs had going tonight. Tyler showed exactly why Chris Grant took him over heralded celebrity stars last year. Kyrie looks tired. People need to stop the “Mr. 4th-Quarter” stuff. He is a great scorer, excellent shooter, and great kid, but he is not a point guard at this point. When he went one-on-one at the end of… Read more »
I can pretty safely say that I know Kyrie’s ankle was bothering him tonight. Just trust me on that. That said, my biggest concern with KYrie is, has been, and will continue to be his attitude once he starts missing. He starts sulking. He starts loafing. He gets down on himself. He doesn’t decide to go effect the game in a different way. He just pouts. Got to start sucking it up and playing through it when he’s off. Now, is this line a joke? ““mediocre three-point gunner who only sorta plays defense and only drives once a game” title… Read more »
Is Waiters going to snap this season he has been getting hacked hard when attacking the basket that’s why I don’t blame him for shooting as many jumpers.
Third straight diva game for Kyrie. He needs to stop trying to win every game in the 4th quarter by himself. He went 1 on 2, 1 on 3 repeatedly in the last 5 minutes to disastrous results. It was painful. Shooters were open. His ball-hoggery was inexcusable. Much of this is Byron’s fault. How much iso-Kyrie do you need to get him used to taking last second shots? Time to teach him how to actually execute an offensive play with the game on the line. It’s ok to use him as a decoy, especially when Waiters was as hot… Read more »