Links to the Present: Summer Doldrums Edition
2014-07-28
The Cavs inked their number one draft pick, Andrew Wiggins, on Friday. He can no longer be traded for thirty days. So the team has until August 23rd to figure out a trade for Love not involving Wiggins. While this is my hope, it seems unlikely that the Wolves will make any deal with the Cavs that doesn’t involve their talented wing prospect.
A little more disturbing about the potential acquisition of Kevin is that his second year on his current contract is a player option. Most reports are saying he plans on opting out of that second year to become an unrestricted free agent. Doing that would benefit Love in several ways according to Tom Carpenter of ESPN.
Love would gain some flexibility by having the right to hit the market as a full-fledged unrestricted free agent in the summer of 2015, because he could sign with any team he wishes. That means if things don’t work well with the Cavs, or if James opts out next summer, Love wouldn’t be stuck there an extra year.
There is a slight chance that the Cavs could lose LeBron, and even Love if they acquire him, to the opt out option next year. Thankfully, it seems unlikely that LeBron would leave after professing his love of Cleveland. It even seems unlikely Love would opt out and just not come back given that he is requesting to be traded to Cleveland.
Mike Mayer of Fear The Sword has a piece up breaking down the cost of acquiring a superstar via trade. It is pretty clear that Wiggins will probably need to be included to make a Love trade happen, as there is no Pu Pu platter that the Cavs can offer with proper value.
LeBron James is going back to his old number, 23. This was the number LeBron wore coming into the league, and it’s also Michael Jordan’s number. There is also a chance the Cavs will play the Spurs on opening night. LeBron will have to summon his inner MJ, if this is the case, to beat the team that has now beat him in the finals twice.
Brett Zellman has spoken about the Dion Waiters’ Twitter incident with some authority for Waiting For Next Year. On Twitter, Waiters simply said he wouldn’t accept a bench role. This was actually an honest answer and he should be lauded for it.
We criticize athletes for their canned, cliched answers but then we get an honest answer and freak out? It’s a bit hypocritical. Waiters believes in his abilities and that confidence is clearly visible on the court. Furthermore, are we even sure Dion won’t be starting?
Dion isn’t going to cause any issues on the court or in the locker room. Who doesn’t want to be in the highest possible position within their organization?
Update —
According to Steve Kyler at Basketsball Insider, the rumors that Love favors Cleveland above all are exaggerated.
Sources close to Love have said they were urging people to dial back the “Cleveland or else” message and that while Love seems open to all three of the situations being seriously considered – Cleveland, Golden State and Chicago, he is not willing to commit long-term to any of them as a first action.
are we living in an alternate universe where the lakers hire all of cleveland’s cast-off coaches?
I live in LA and argue with gaked out Lakers fans everyday. They are actually excited over Scott and Boozer.
Eh. Byron’s not a bad coach when he doesn’t want to be. Of course he had Jason Kidd and Chris Paul… Lakers probably knew they were going to suck anyway so they threw Scott a bone. NVM. You’re right. The Kobe farewell tour is a trip down denial. Gonna be fun to watch.
OK, I’ll add to the rumors dujour. I have a friend who works at the Cleveland Clinic in Florida. He knows I am a Cavs fan, so he called me today to tell me that he heard from a pal at the Cleveland Clinic in Ohio that Kevin Love was in there today getting a physical. The pal isn’t a Cavs fan, but he knows the Cavs doctors and they were giving him the full physical. Interesting if nothing else. However, while I am not a sports journalist, I am a video games journalist who was a Comic Con in… Read more »
That’s an interesting scoop.
Tony O – Next year, between LBJ, KI, Wiggins, Waiters, Bennett, TT, Mike Miller, and Joe Harris we will be around $58 million. Throw in some type of extension for Varejao, the cap holds for the MLE and the bi-annial exception, and we will be pretty darn close to operating as a capped team.
Bottom line: whether we trade for Love or not, moving forward we will likely be operating as a capped team, and the MLE is likely going to be the biggest chunk of cash we have to bring in a new piece each year.
Gibson won that important game in Detroit by himself, what I’am trying to say is , give James some talent and he makes them a lot better.
Close. The game was in Cleveland. That’s when we clinched the Eastern Conference. I was there. It was a hell of a game!
The first year of big three in Miami was kind of getting to know each other, same should be for Cavs. We don’t have to give up so many assets for Love, Love is a great player but we really don’t need him that bad. We will have cap money next year and three first round draft, we can get a great rim protector and decent scorer out of the market. Let James have a year with youngesters, he made stars out of kind of Bobby and Demon and even Wally , think what he can do with Waiter, TT,… Read more »
He made stars out of who? Wally and Jones were terrible. Gibson never lived up to the talent.
what I really like about CTB —is you get educated in a variety of subjects ( not just basketball ) from yesterday’s blog —-I am now consuming a very delicious/ delightful LAGUNITAS –LITTLE SUMPIN —- it goes down as advertised —here to you mike miller and hopefully ray allen——-the owner of the store here in Sandusky is going to try and get me the ” elite ” PINY THE ELDER —will give you bloggers a follow up report —sorry I got off the subject of kevin love and possible trades but sometimes we all need a break —–here’s to you… Read more »
You’d think that Saunders wouldn’t want this circus showing up at training camp. I don’t blame Saunders for spreading false rumors to get other teams to raise their bid for Love. He’s doing his job. He’s not going to get everything he wants though. He’s not going to be able to ditch Martin and Barea’s contracts, get Wiggins and Bennett and multiple first round picks. I don’t want to give up Wiggins at all, but having a core of Lebron, Love, Irving, Waiters, Thompson, Andy and Delly along Hayward’s contract and the ability to trade for a center next year… Read more »
It’s interesting how the Wolves and Love play this out. A large part of me wants no trade to happen this year so that next year we can make an offer to Love without the loss of any core talent. Putting Love in the position to be able tochoose where he goes according to prefered location and chance to win. This also takes the ‘pressure’ off of Cleveland to give up so many assets and flexibility for a guy who may only be here 1 year.
How are we going to make an offer to Love in free agency? We won’t have sufficient cap space.
We will do a sign and trade with who ever is holding onto Love at that time. Be it Minny or someone else. And yes, they will do it if they are loosing him anyway. We did the same for LBJ in 2010.
But if we are going to have to do a sign and trade and give up assets, why wait another year? The team trading with us will know we can’t sign him as a FA, and can thus hold us hostage in the trade.
Yep. Waiting for a sign & trade only postpones, and potentially increases, the same kind of competition for Love that we are currently seeing.
I completely reject the mantra that the Cavs must trade Wiggins in order to get Love. It’s ridiculous. And I’m hoping that Griffin actually knows how to negotiate deals to give us a chance to aquire Love without dealing Wiggins. Minnesota’s options are pretty limited. The Warriors seem to have hardened around the notion of not trading Klay. Chicago’s owner promised Mirotec they would not trade him and he seems to be a man of his word. The Celtics can’t offer anything greater than we can I don’t think anyone else has the pieces to make things happen. I can… Read more »
I don’t think Minny goes for that deal — MAYBE if the Cavs give up two first rounders. Also, I don’t see why Philly would want Haywood. His contract is of no use to them. Though they could flip it… Still, it’s an interesting trade. Feel like the Cavs need to come up with a couple more junk contracts to make this work. Also feel like Joe Harris is clogging up a roster spot. The Cavs do have some junk guys. I wonder if it’s possible to sign some of the foreign players the Cavs have rights to, in order… Read more »
I think that Minnesota might go for the deal that I set forth above (see at 2:38pm). It also would be pretty cretve. It appears that Minn. really values T. Young of Phily. From the Cavs perspective, the issue is how much do they and LBJ value TT. I would do the deal if the Cavs netted Love and Martin and also retained Wigins.
Love+Martin is 23 million in salary. It just doesn’t work.
It is two separate trades. In the first Cavs give up Dion/TT or Bennett and a renounceable contract and get K. Martin. Min gives up Baera and K Martin and gets Young. Philly gives up Young and takes back one of the Cleveland palyers and Baera and probably draft picks. That would work. In the second trade for Love, so long as Cleveland is under the salary cap before the trade they can do a trade in which they take back 150% of the salary that they send out even if the result of the trade puts them over the… Read more »
Yeah, I was presuming the Cavs would also send 2-3 future picks to Minny. I t=don’t think that you can designate future picks with the trade machine. Minny will make a deal – even one that they don’t like – because they have no alternative. They can try keeping Love, but it will be really tough. Their roster isn’t much improved (no disrespect to Mo Williams), the West is still ultracompetitive, and the KLove situation will weigh down tht team. I suppose it’s possible that Minny keeps him and let’s the season play out and hopes that if he still… Read more »
If Love was smart he’d seriously consider Phoenix, which has both the players and the assets to compete and make the deal. An S&T with Bledsoe+Morris Brother actually makes sense for both teams. Bledsoe and Rubio could play together and would be defensive terrors. Love would have a much better supporting cast in phoenix and able to put up gonzo numbers. But yeah… Part of the reason I don’t like Love is he seems like a prima dona.
True, I forgot about Phoenix.
Bledsoe’s value is really hard to gage, though – he was injured and he really only has half a season of great play. Minny can potentially get Bledsoe and Young and dump Martin in the process: http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=qfen5ov
The Suns would probably have to throw in some picks, too.
Given how so many CtB folks want the Cavs to roll with the team we have, I can imagine that some of the Cavs brass may be thinking the same thing. The notion that Lebron leaves after a year is ridiculous. But Love might. You never know.
I threw up something similar to that a couple weeks ago. Philly giving up Young and taking on Kevin Martin’s contract just for Dion Waiters is the issue of the trade. You’d probably have to sweeten the pot a little for them as well. I don’t think it’s that bad of a deal for Minny. Young can be the starter at PF now and they can groom Bennett. The real issue is that we hold Waiters and even Bennett in higher regard than most other people. Bennett should shine next to Lebron and his value will increase. LBJ made Hickson… Read more »
Bennett should probably go. He will be no good with the Cavs. You can bet good money on big B having one of those vintage 0-10 nights with 0-7 on 3’s. Or may be even a 5-35 week. I mean, the man is unconscious shooting the ball.
With LBJ around, that will put you in the dog house and keep you there for good.
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=q87hdq9
I can dream …
I’m not willing to give up as much as everybody else is for Love – especially considering there’s no guarantee he’s going to resign with the Cavs. There are always other strong teams in highly desirable locations outside of Cleveland. It’s likely he’ll sign – but how do you give up everything that everyone is talking about without a guarantee?
But yeah, if we can get Love and Noel out of a trade – as your link suggests – I’d be willing to give up a lot. Barring injury, Noel will eventually be a top NBA post.
Regarding the twitter issues with Dion, he said he wasn’t going to discuss it anymore because of all the uproar over it, but he made a comment that people need to lighten up and have more of a sense of humor about it. He was having fun on twitter with some of his fans. No question he wants to be a starter but I don’t think he’s going to be disruptive if it doesn’t break that way.
Wiggins and Bennett plus those Utah guys and 1 first rounder for Love thats it nothing else period, take it or leave it. I bet they take it.
Put away the hookah.
Kindly disregard this comment. I forgot to engage brain before hitting submit.
The last rumor of Love not willing to sign an extension would be a problem considering the Cavs may be considering to give up Wiggins ,Bennett, a couple of first round picks & take on the bad contract of Martin & JJ Berea for a 1 year rental. That’s a hell of a lot to give up.
Minnesota has some leverage, but Golden State, Chicago and the Cavs all have to assign some risk to Love not resigning if he is acquired in a trade. He is clearly going to opt out and become a free agent.The only financial advantage to Love in signing with a team who trades for him is he can sign a 5 year contract at about $130MM instead of a 4 year contract at about $100MM. There is not much difference in the per annum salary and if he plays well he could be better off with the 4 year contract since… Read more »
So, worst case in 2015, Cleveland will lose LBJ (opt-out), Love (free-agent) + no 2015 draft picks + no Dion, no Bennett, no TT, no Delly. Just Kyrie who cannot play defense and a bunch of garbage. This is like 2010 all over again. And this time the odds will be against us winning 3 out of 4 top seeds. I say no trade. LBJ likes it or otherwise. Simply try to sign/sign&trade for Love next year. Worst case 2015, we will have kyrie, wiggins, waiters, TT and delly + draft picks. And if we are lucky, +LBJ +Love. I… Read more »
Possibly to get his $20M this year and then take less for Kevin Love to get the $20M contract in year 1 (with us)? Maybe Love’s is front loaded (and gets smaller) and LeBron’s is smaller up front and gets bigger?
It just creates flexibiltiy for him and hopefully that results in flexibility for us.
If your worst case scenario, or something similar were to happen there would be no reason to follow the Cavs at all for 5-6 years. After the habit of following them was broken, it would be difficult to get back into them.
Seriously, I haven’t followed the Indians since they cut their second Cy Young award winner loose. Why bother. How long ago was that?
I just don’t have the time to follow this team if they gut it and the wheels fall off again. However, I CAN get into watching these young guys develop over the next 5-6 years.
“Seriously, I haven’t followed the Indians since they cut their second Cy Young award winner loose. Why bother?”
Me neither. And I was a die hard baseball fan. Completely stopped after watching CC & Lee get shipped for nothing. Haven’t looked back since. I couldn’t even tell you half of their roster right now.
Yep. I had other problems with baseball/MLB, but shipping out back-to-back Cy Young Award winners in consecutive years was like poison to me, and I was a Tribe fan since ’59. And, i didn’t just lose interest in the Tribe, I stopped following baseball.
The worst case scenario with the Love trade would be disaster. The Cavs have been really hard for me to watch the past couple years as is. The Love trade talk makes me feel like someone slipped me crazy pills.
” double R’S ‘—- Raoul and rickoh—support your thinking 100 %—-hopefully so do the cavs brass—they now have time to really evaluate this trade–pro’s/ cons—–bring wiggns in and have him workout with LeBron/ kyrie etc— get the necessary feedback from all before we ” pull the trigger ” and have regrets —-I like t.t. ( like rickoh said and realize the agent relationship with LeBron ) but if we have the leverage and can make t.t. part of the deal and save wiggins and a waiters or Bennett this is the path we need to pursue—like kennny rogers said n… Read more »
So if the rumors of this past week are true, Minnesota is w/o leverage anymore. Everything thats come out since Friday has said Wiggins is off the table and there is no reason the Cavs have to include him. Until a trade is done though, conflicting rumors are going to keep coming out. But again, the latest is it sounds like the Chicago offer was a smokescreen, GS is not offering anything of value, Boston has nothing to offer and Kevin Love says he will only sign with the Cavs and no one else. Hence, no leverage for Minny and… Read more »
I think TT will blossom under Blatt. He hustles and he has a willingness to retool his game. If he stays with Cleveland, he can only benefit from Lebron and the vets coming on board.
I tend to agree….from combination of Blatt, and the fact that he’ll be a forgotten man with all of the attention given to Lebron, Kyrie & co. He’ll be a perfect garbage man, and will benefit from the fact that he won’t be relied on to produce offense. TT “fits” a Lebron/Love roster better than Bennett does, even though Beneett has more upside.
A forgotten man who is still going to get rejected by the rim after double clutching 3 times before going up. Those are skills you don’t lose easily no matter if the best player is giving you the ball on a silver platter. I’ve rooted for TT, I’ve been enthused and hopeful when he had what appeared to be breakout games only to regress again and again. Its time for the Cavs to let him go. If not this trade, then at least in the next year. Both he and Waiters have contract extensions coming up. TT doesn’t deserve a… Read more »
I think Tristan is gonna play the Udonis Haslem role, but just a tad better because he’s an ironman (never injured, lead the team in minutes and miles run). Haslem has that little baseline 12 footer though, and hopefully Thompson can get that down. If he plays starters minutes, he’s a lock to average a DD. He’s going to have a strong season.
Hell probably get paid 9 mil a year or something stupid. I think 5 mil is probably fair.
If its Bennett or Thompson, I’d rather have Bennett’s upside as well.
I’d be happy to see how our Big 2 or 3 (with Love) stacks up against San Anotnio’s Big 3.
Of course Minnesorta will trade without Wiggins. The alternative is to not trade and get nothing in a year. They are hoping to get the Cavs to bid against themselves, the way A-Rod’s agent got the Yankees to when he got his last 10 year contract. Everybody knows the Yankees were idiots to fall for it. They have been bums ever since.
1) Thats not the case 2) Even if it were it doesn’t mean they’d do it. Even if we are the only team that wants a 25 year old 26 and 12 strech 4 it doesnt mean that they have to give him to us for anything less then are best trade package that still makes us better. Flip could believe that we will change our minds on Wiggins eventually and therefore not trade him. Then gambles that we will cave first and never backs off his stance. This is honestly what I’d do if I were Flip Saunders. The… Read more »