Dividing Up The Frontcourt Minutes
2015-10-26With the Cleveland Cavaliers set to open their season against the Chicago Bulls tomorrow night at the United Center, things are looking up for LeBron James and company. Kevin Love has returned to action. Anderson Varejao is healthy. Tristan Thompson has returned to the team after signing a five year $82 million deal, and is expected to play, Tuesday. LeBron James will also likely play after dealing with some back trouble for the past two weeks. While Kyrie Irving and Iman Shumpert are still out, the Cavaliers are beginning to gain the depth they had hoped to create this offseason.
The funny thing with professional basketball though, is that depth isn’t always that easy to manage. Part of the reason NBA players have been able to reach the highest level of play is the fact that they have the highest level of confidence in themselves. Show me an NBA player who doesn’t think they should be playing significant minutes, and I’ll show you someone who will soon be a former NBA player.
In the case of the Cleveland Cavaliers, they are blessed with a relatively deep and talented frontcourt. Kevin Love is an All-Star caliber player whose combination of elite rebounding, passing, and outside shooting are truly unique. Timofey Mozgov is far and away the Cavaliers’ best rim protector with the ability to play both as a roll man and in the post on offense, and the Cavaliers’ defense was significantly better upon his arrival from the Denver Nuggets in January. Tristan Thompson is an elite—sorry David—offensive rebounder and pick-and-roll finisher whose ability to switch onto perimeter players defensively was a big part of the Cavaliers’ postseason success. Anderson Varejao is still a high energy big man who has become an extremely skilled offensive player to go along with his own solid rebounding ability. Even newcomer Sasha Kaun has been described by general manager David Griffin as possibly a rotational player for the team. The question is, are the minutes there for each man?
It’s common to talk about the minutes of different players in vague terms without really thinking about the minutes available. The fact of the matter is that there are just 96 minutes of court time that are available to these men. While all five can play center or power forward, none can play down any farther. Last season, Love played 33.8 minutes per game, his lowest since his second year in the league, but still the most of any Cavalier big man. Mozgov also started after he joined the team, averaging 25.0 minutes per game. Despite not starting, Thompson actually played a bit more than Mozgov at 26.8 minutes per game. Before tearing his achilles tendon, Varejao was the Cavaliers’ starting center, averaging 24.5 minutes per game. This adds up to 110.1 minutes per game, and that’s not even taking into account any time for Kaun. Furthermore, LeBron James will likely spend some time a power forward this season, and David Blatt has used James Jones almost exclusively as a stretch four since he joined the team.
So how does David Blatt manage the minutes for his big men? Whose minutes get cut? Who doesn’t play? This question may be surprisingly easy to answer. It starts with Varejao, who is likely the fourth big man in the Cavaliers’ rotation. Andy has looked solid in his return to the court, but there is simply no way that he plays anywhere near 24 minutes a game given his age and injury history. Another factor some would point to as a reason to play him less would be his negatively impact on the court last season, although that could be partly attributed to small sample size as well as the Cavaliers’ overall struggles. After all he did have a higher RPM than players like Chris Bosh, Zach Randolph, and Paul Millsap the prior season. No matter what, if the Cavaliers want Anderson Varejao healthy for the postseason, it simply makes sense to keep his minutes down as less time on the court means fewer chances for an injury to occur. Because of that it makes sense to cut Varejao’s minutes per game by just over 50%, and play him a rather conservative 12 minutes a game. This number should allow Varejao to stay sharp while also reducing his chances for injury. If Love and Thompson—both of whom are under contract for five more years and have less reason to push for more minutes—play slightly less at 33 and 26 minutes per night respectively, and Mozgov keeps his average at 25 minutes per game, that comes out to 96 minutes per night, exactly what the Cavaliers have to give.
Obviously there are still questions. When does LeBron play power forward? What about James Jones and Sasha Kaun? In the case of LeBron, it’s important that we remember that not only does he not like to play the four, but that play down in the post and having to bang with big men more often likely wouldn’t be great for his back, which seems to have become a chronic issue. Even if he’s no longer quite the freak athlete he used to be, there is no sign that James won’t continue to be athletic enough to play small forward for the duration of his career. While there is no doubt that he will play power forward at times, it is a strategy that the Cavaliers will likely only need to use sporadically, especially since a Love-Thompson front court allows the Cavaliers to match most small ball lineups defensively while still playing big.
James Jones has given the Cavaliers more than anyone really expected of him since he signed with the team prior to last season. He’s a tremendous outside shooter and locker room voice who competes at both ends of the floor. But an honest assessment would tell you that Jones probably shouldn’t be a regular member of the rotation. Despite trying hard, Jones is an enormous liability on the defensive end, lacking both the strength to guard power forwards and the quickness to keep up with perimeter players. When his shot is not falling, Jones is virtually unplayable, and a player like that is best used as a specialist used in certain situations, which tend to arise as a particular game is being played versus certain matchups. Finally, given his injury history, Varejao will likely be given the night off on a fairly regular basis—either due to coach’s decision or yet another injury—and Jones can slide into his spot, spacing the floor while playing alongside Thompson or Mozgov.
This still leaves Sasha Kaun. This is where the harsh reality of the NBA comes in. Before the season, one could reasonably argue the Kaun was the Cavaliers’ fourth big man in the rotation, ahead of Anderson Varejao. After a preseason in which Kaun averaged 2.7 points and 3.5 rebounds in 18 minutes per game, that hardly seems the case. Kaun has looked solid defensively, particularly around the rim, but he seems to be a mediocre rebounder and limited offensive player. While Kaun did post extremely high field goal percentages in Europe, he hasn’t quite found his rhythm around the rim as he adjusts to the NBA. That will likely improve somewhat, but for now Kaun seems somewhat similar to the player he is replacing, Kendrick Perkins. That isn’t bad for a team’s fifth big man, it’s just not good enough for third big man on a contender. For now it seems likely that Kaun will get most of his minutes in blowouts and when another big man needs a night off.
Another important thing to consider is that the Cavaliers have 20 sets of back-to-back games this season, fifth most in the NBA. Given the health issues of some players as well as the team’s desire to make sure that everyone is peaking for the playoffs, it seems likely that the rotation could vary when the Cavaliers play consecutive nights. A fairly probably scenario would be something like Varejao not playing in the first night of the back-to-back, but playing 25 or more minutes the second night as one of Love, Mozgov, or Thompson gets the night off. As we’ve discussed Kaun or Jones will also likely get minutes these nights to give other big men some rest. This doesn’t mean that Kaun would play Kevin Love’s minutes if Love were to sit a game out. Rather Kaun might play ten to fifteen minutes while another big man, say Tristan Thompson, sees his minutes jump that night. This strategy could be used with any player to keep him both fresh and rested.
While all of this may seem like a bit of a convenient solution, it’s also a realistic one for the Cavaliers. In fact, it wouldn’t be a big surprise to see Love average something closer to 30 minutes per game considering he will still be working his way back from injury early, and the Cavs will likely make sure he is both sharp and fresh for the playoffs. This would also allow some more leeway for different lineups, giving James some time to play brief minutes at power forward, or allowing Varejao or Jones a bit more run a times. While David Blatt will no doubt want to find a rotation that he likes, there is also no doubt that the minutes various players get will likely fluctuate night to night.Regardless, having a surplus of quality players competing for minutes is something every title contender needs. This was never more apparent than during the NBA Finals, when the Cavaliers were decimated by injury and David Blatt wasn’t willing to play veterans such as Kendrick Perkins, Shawn Marion, Mike Miller, and Brendan Haywood. And who could blame him? The Cavaliers were carrying dead weight at the end of their roster. Now, with the return to health of Love and Varejao and the addition of Kaun, the Cavaliers seem to have a frontcourt that is both deep and diverse. That alone could make all the difference this season as the Cavaliers try to take care of the unfinished business of winning an NBA Championship.
Does anyone else feel like the offseason barely existed? Tonight feels like an extension of last season, as if the finals were a week ago, and the games beginning tonight are a continuation of the previous season.
I don’t know. I can’t quite put my finger on it. It’s a strange feeling coming into the season.
This is the most continuity between seasons I can remember. All the important players are back, coaches are all back. Really the only thing missing is the easy going locker room presence of Mike Miller, which should be more than counter-balanced by upgrades at several reserve positions (Andy, RJ, Kaun)
Unless I missed the memo on some serious sarcasm, this Chicago Tribune writer has already mailed in the Bulls’ chances against Lebron even before the season begins. I could not help but laugh.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/rosenblog/ct-bulls-lebron-james-rosenbloom-20151027-column.html
@JasonLloydABJ: President Obama expected to attend tonight’s opener between #Cavs and Bulls: https://t.co/TGUXe4DvxT
I am pacing around drinking more coffee than usual and then tonight more alcohol than normal. Team player that is
All In.
Bill Simmons is doing some serious trolling to the Nets.
GET EXCITED!!!
Hey, that team could be pretty good.
Jalen Rose doesn’t think the Cavs are one of the 5 best teams in the league… Lol.
Jalen isn’t one of the five best former NBA players turned commentators…
He’s awful. He’s the woody woodpecker of commentators.
Let me guess 5 teams in west are better that way he could never really have to admit he is wrong until the finals. What a Barney!
Chalk up another moronic thing Rose has said. I’ll grant him one thing – he’s politically savvy. Hitching his wagon to Simmons was smart. He brings nothing to the table as a commentator, though.
Normal game:
KLove 32
Moz 22
TT 30
AV 12
2nd night of BTB:
KLove 28
Moz 20
TT 32
JFJ 12
Kaun 8
Can’t wait to see what we’ll get tonight. Anything could happen — the first few weeks of the NBA are so unpredictable.
Did I miss the season predications post?
The Brow will win MVP.
Cavs take the title. THIS IS THE YEAR!
This is it. See you all guys tomorrow.
ALL FOR ONE, ONE FOR ALL.
ALL IN.
WE ARE CAVALIERS.
Nice article guy. I’m down with Andy playing 10 minutes per night and never, and I mean never, playing in a back to back. I’m really excited to see Andy share the court with Moz. They’ll get killed on switches, but having a legit rim protector behind Andy should help.
I can’t sleep. I am making the assumption that it is due to my excitement for the start of the season. Cavs-eve is a rough holiday, if only because I am the only one who celebrates it.
I feel you J, nobody where I’m at could care less about nba right now but it makes me even more excited. Go Cavs
My honest opinion is that the Cavs will have a slow start of the season since the first 7 games of the season will be the real preseason for LeBron, JR, Kevin Love etc. So we’ll have to be patient at first and maybe by mid December or early January we will see the Cavs at full strength. Let’s hope that Jefferson can do a better back up job for LeBron than Marion did last year. I know it is important to be healthy and that the most important thing is how the Cavs are paying come March-April but I… Read more »
Same here. I am pretty much resigned to losing the opener.
You’re resigned to losing the opener? Why?
And @JB225… take a look at the seven games following the first three… not exactly difficult…
Mainly due to the Cavs health at this point. No Irving, no Shump (and remember, the Cavs defense was shaky at best before they got Shump last season), who knows how healthy Lebron is right now, and TT may or may not be 100% ready to play. I know the Bulls are missing Dunleavy, but they just seem to be in better shape for the opener.
Except for DRose’s double vision… right? Jury is out on Hoiberg’s new style of play. Cavs know who they are.
The new coaching staff is a fair point. I’m still sort of expecting to be disappointed tonight, though. We’ll know soon enough.
I just want to see the second team close out the 4th quarter when handed a 14 point lead. That would give Lebron, Love, Kyrie, Mozgov, and others all the rest they’d need over the course of the season. It would be especially helpful in back-to-backs.
Perhaps we can discuss a 4th quarter “close it out” lineup up some time.
That’s a good question, because the answer is not obvious at all. At least when fully healthy, say in February. A fairly logical starting point would be Harris, MJD, and Kaun, but guess what, two of those players figure to be inactives every night (again, that’s when fully healthy). PG screams Delly all the way SG Harris/MJD whichever is active SF Jefferson PF JFJ C is where I stumble. Kaun as 5th big will prolly be inactive most nigts. Andy is next up, but don’t know if you wanna give him garbage minutes and risk needless injury. I seem to… Read more »
COLS SINCE YOU ARE SO DOWN ON SASHA DO YOU THINK / HOPE THE CAVS GO AFTER PERRY JONES –DO YOU THINK HE IS MORE SUITABLE PLAYER FOR THE CAVS THAN SAHA –JUST WONDERING —WASN’T SO LONG AGO GRANGER WAS THE PACERS PROTECTED PLAYER
Nope he sucks too. We don’t newfangled
I hope Sasha sucks as bad as Delly did last year. Near MVP of a finals game. Not bad for sucking.
Remember when Danny Granger was really good? Sad to see he’s now more in the company of guys like Brandon Roy and Michael Redd…
I don’t think Danny Granger was ever as good as the other 2 at everyone’s peaks…
Listened to the Delly interview. The last question they asked him was who is the toughest guy to defend in the NBA. Delly named pretty much every PG but Curry…
That is awesome.
Haha. Nice job Delly. Way to troll the GSW.
Just a comment on Delly: I think he is perhaps the best example in the NBA of a player with very limited athleticism who is successful because of his exceptional tenacity and smarts. Amazing that he has done as well as he has given his limitations….but a great example for the underdogs to look at.
Love to see some Love/TT lineups at the forwards with Andy or Moz at center. TT can guard threes and leak out with the guards for outlet passes. Worth a shot to outsize some folks.
That number of back-to-backs is ridiculous. Way to devalue your product, NBA.
I really believe LeBron should not play any more back-to-backs in his career (both nights), to have proper recovery time and avoid accelerating his physical decline. But the league just makes it impossible. No way a healthy LeBron can sit more than a few games without creating an international incident.
They can be smart about them, though. Pick a few that he definitely sits. For others, if we’re ahead by double digits (or down) in a game that probably won’t mean much big picture, sit him in the second half and live with the results. Hell, even if he sits for all 20, so what? He played 69 games last year and we still got the 2nd seed and walked to the finals. so he sits for 7 more games than that. We have greater depth, chemistry, and coaching by virtue of the team being together for a year now.… Read more »
Kahn will lead in minutes!! All of you wait and see. KING KAUN DPOY!!!
Everyone is using 96 as the baseline for minutes…. With DNPs / nights off (which don’t count in MPG), I would imagine everyone’s MPG stats will add up over 100 minutes. I’d be curious to see the breakdown of last years minutes taking DNPs / nights off into account….ie Minutes Played / 82G. (But right now I’m too lazy (and yet busy at the same time….back to work! lol) to look up everything and calculate ;) ….maybe tonight) Obviously AV’s numbers would skew crazy low, but it would give another look at the minutes game…. So, I’ll say something more… Read more »
Check this out:
http://espn.go.com/espn/feature/story/_/id/13953903/how-lebron-james-building-empire-cleveland
These guy claim to have the inside story. (Of course, one of them is Windbag)
Was so unimpressed by this piece. People have so over blown his role in the franchise. He’s by far the most influential person in the organization and the entire league, but the portrayal is so inaccurate. Media operates through hyperboles.
Yeah I saw this. Had a surprisingly small amount of meaningful content for a “feature” story (and one with so much detailed artwork),
Look, I’m sure LeBron pulls some serious weight when it comes to the Cavs, but I find it pretty hard to believe that he has a “when I say jump…” relationship with Griffin and Gilbert. That article made everyone in the Cavs look like LeBron’s little b***h.
Just about every damning “fact” is a Windy quote or resource.
Yeah, this piece was total trash. I started reading it and within two lines I thought, huh, must be a windy article. I read all that last year when Blatt was being fired.
Windhorst eats this kind of crap up like jellybeans. And he might as well, since ESPN is paying him to produce precisely this crap. What a crappy ‘article’.
The truly AMAZING thing is that Windy has gone on rants about how his conversations on the BS report are not actual reporting, and that fans over-react to them, etc. Now those same quotes are the whole basis of this story. Incredible. They are basically just making stuff up and calling it fact.
Here’s a major issue with this article and any other like it. For ten years, Peyton manning has basically been his own offensive coordinator and no one ever criticized him, Tony Dungy, Tom Moore, or John Fox for it. For six years, Ray Lewis split DC duties with the actual coaching staff and no one complained. Player-coaches used to be a regular thing in the NBA, from Bill Russell to World B. Free. Why must LeBron be undermining the coach by playong an assistant role? Why must he be undermining the GM by recruiting players when that just made him… Read more »
Man, I’m so glad that LBJ didn’t force us to keep Miller for another year. I go back and forth on whether to play AV at all. On the one hand, he’s useful, on the other hand, he’s prone to injury. I kind of like the idea of coming into the playoffs with AV completely healthy and an ace in the hole if we need him. I mean, we didn’t need AV at all last year to get to the finals. Its hindsight, of course, but wouldn’t we have been better off with him not playing a single game and… Read more »
I like the idea and concept of this, but I think there is no way that Love gets so few minutes in practice….
Yuck. I really really hope that Love isn’t playing just 25 minutes a game.
To start the season after a serious injury and long rehab? Yeah, let’s pile on heavy minutes and risk re-injuring his shoulder for the first three months of the regular season.
Agreed. It’s highly unlikely Andy never plays, even if Jones gets more run. There is now way Mozgov only plays 20 minutes a game and Kaun averages just one minute. Even if Kaun doesn’t play regularly, he will average at least five to ten minutes when he does play. I would bet the farm on that.
How much did Perkins play? Kaun is not as good as Perkins so he will probably play less than that.
Fine, but he won’t average 1 min per game, and Mozgov will average more than 20.
Yeah, he will see alot of DNP-coaches decision until AV gets injured sometime in December. Then 1-2 minutes a game I think.
Do we actually know what Kaun is? He hasn’t played one regular season game yet. I don’t think Andy plays in back-2-backs so that should provide maybe 5 minutes a night for Kaun. I don’t think it’s a stretch to suggest he will more impactful than Perkins.
Kaun? He’s a white Kendrick Perkins. Maybe not quite as mean.
Nice article, Mike!
It will be interesting to see whether Kaun is an actual rotational player or if he’ll wind up just as glued to the bench as Perk was last year. If he’s got serviceable game, it allows Blatt to divvy out a ton of rest over the course of the season, to Andy and Mozgov in particular. Give Andy one game off in every five or six…
Bench glue. Perkins role. Probably not as good as Perkins.
Thanks Robert, I have very little idea of what Kaun will be, but it wouldn’t shock me if he earned minutes just because Blatt trusts him due to their previous time together.
Delly will be on 92.3, Bull and Fox, today at 5:25.
Love 32 minutes
Moz 20 minutes
TT 32 minutes
JFJ 11 minutes
Kaun 1 minutes
Would rather see Moz at 25 and TT at 27…
And you’re crazy to put JFJ at 11 and no time for AV… Just because you don’t think he’ll stay healthy, doesn’t mean he won’t…
OK
Love 32
Moz 20
TT 30
JFJ 10
AV 4
How’s that?
Love 32
Moz 25
TT 27
AV 12
JFJ (only in certain situations)
Everyone is using 96 as the baseline for minutes…. With DNPs / nights off (which don’t count in MPG), I would imagine everyone’s MPG stats will add up over 100 minutes. I’d be curious to see the breakdown of last years minutes taking DNPs / nights off into account….ie Minutes Played / 82G. (But right now I’m too lazy (and yet busy at the same time….back to work! lol) to look up everything and calculate ;) ….maybe tonight) Obviously AV’s numbers would skew crazy low, but it would give another look at the minutes game…. So, I’ll say something more… Read more »
Anybody else see the article about the Mavs owning Dirk a shot at finishing his career with a competitive squad and that his 8.1MM fits into our BHTE?
Owing***********
At this point though, Dirk is just a much lesser version of KLove… I’d much rather have someone for guard depth for the BHTE…
Dirk would be a massive addition. But it’s probably not happening./
Where would he play? They don’t need more frontcourt help…
He’s Dirk. Who cares where he’d play. He can have JFJs minutes. He can spell Kevin Love.
He can’t guard anyone anymore… don’t need him.
I’m having trouble saying this, but in this instance I’m with Cols. At this point in his career, Dirk is basically a 7 foot JFJ. If you can get the same value out of a bigger guy you go with the bigger guy. The only issue there would be the effect on the locker room in general and LeBron in particular that removing Jones would have.
He’s old and slow and can’t play defense at all. You usually hate those guys, except when you love them, apparently.
I have been thinking that ever since the Mavs fiasco with whats-his-name, the goofball Clipper The Mavs need to tank for a couple years. Cuban is a stand up guy, who would hate to see Dirk end up in that situation. Cuban would also likely enjoy p$ssing everyone else off by giving DN to the Cavs, where he could still be a hero a few times. Ideally he will trade DN for SJH. Then Joe could help the Mavs tank and possibly develop into a role player. Will Joe ever reach the Alonzo Gee level of competence?
I do agree with all of this perspective.
I could easily see Cuban loving this idea – letting the Mavs tank, piss off people / upset the system, and give Dirk some more hero time (both are very loyal characters) – this is easily a plausible scenario…lol.
And I love packaging Joe Harris with the Brendan Haywood Trade Exception as well…get that (albeit small amount of) money off the books. As much as I didn’t care for Gee, no I don’t think Harris will reach that level.
Problem with Dirk is that he likely doesn’t move the needle for a contender. The only teams he would improve are bad ones. As has been noted, his defense is atrocious and his offense isn’t as good as it used to be. He wouldn’t be an upgrade on our team.
Are you kidding? We are not talking about Dirk starting. But you could have a second unit with Dirk that would blow other teams second unit out of the water. When everyone is back: First Unit: KI, IS, LBJ, KL, TM. Second Unit: MG, JRS, TT, DD, AV. With TT and AV quickness, DN slowness would not be so bad. Think of MG, JRS, and DN firing away. They could beat some teams first unit.
Where did you see this article?
I attempted to find something talking about Dirk’s contract/future, but came up empty, outside of an older article in July or something.
I lived in Dallas for 7 years (went to SMU)….I love me some Dirk Nowitski.
One of the classiest, funnest, funniest, humble, and down-to-earth superstars I’ve ever seen.
And I would love him to be a player (off the bench, behind Love) for the Cavs, and see him winning a ring or two here…lol!
Man, that would be crazy.
Sorry, I was at a wedding all weekend or this would have come with the post. http://www.mavsmoneyball.com/2015/7/13/8937253/dallas-mavericks-nba-free-agency-2015-not-tanking-right-move
Good stuff, Mike… It’s great to have such a deep stable of big men this year. Hope to see Love continue to grow his defensive game, TT continue to grow his offensive game, Moz continue to grow his post moves and hands, AV just stay healthy and Kaun get up to speed on the NBA game…
Good write-up.
Mixing the bench in not only rests the starters but it prepares the bench guys for extended action if the injury bug bites. In the early going, I don’t see TT and Love playing big minutes so Kaun will get his opportunity.
I would also hope Lebron isn’t pressed into any PF action early in the year.
At least you touch on the back-to-back issue… There are 96 minutes each game at the 4 and 5, but when you start taking into consideration that you could rest 1-2 of those guys on back-to-backs, that’s where having the depth gives you the most value. We have 5 potential rotational “bigs”, not counting sporadic James f’in Jones sightings AND LBJ. Perkins + Marion + Miller + Haywood <<<< Kaun + RJ + Mo + AV Managing minutes will be the key factor to getting us to win our first Finals… And finally we are "stacked" with serviceable pieces. Minimizing… Read more »