Recap: Cavs 115 Bucks 100 (Or, Some Answers)
2015-11-20https://twitter.com/cavs/status/667511153787076608/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
After losing at Milwaukee and Detroit, tonight’s rematch with the Bucks was the Cavs’ first chance to respond to some early-season adversity. Mo Williams was declared unavailable prior to the tip and Timofey Mozgov left the game with a shoulder injury, leaving the Cavs sans (arguably) four of their top eight players. While pondering the Live Thread, I came up with three areas where we might find some answers.
We’ll learn whether Mo Williams is young enough to learn new tricks, like, watching game film on MCW and realizing you never, under any circumstance, go OVER a high screen when MCW is the ball-handler.
Well it wasn’t Mo, but we sort of got our answer. The Cavs as a team let MCW have whatever shot he wanted and it paid off. He missed all four of his mid-range shots, including some wide open, “go-ahead-and-step-into-that-15-footer-if-you-so-desire”- shots. Additionally, the Cavs dabbled in switching the pick and roll earlier in the action. This signaled the help defender earlier and the Cavs weren’t caught in no-man’s-land. I’m guessing this was in response to the film session of Sunday’s game at Milwaukee where the Cavs had numerous pick and roll breakdowns.
We’ll learn what it means to LeBron to not be “too nice”. Does it mean he cleans up the turnovers (7 against the Bucks on Sunday) and foregoes telegraphed, one-handed, needle-threading bounce passes to stone-hands Mozgov?
We watched LeBron labor through most of the regular season last year. Tonight his offense seemed pretty effortless. His jumper returned and he drained 8 of 9 free throws. He was still a bit sloppy passing the ball but: 27-6-9 on 13 shots in 35 minutes is that boringly brilliant LeBron that we saw from 2009-2014. Interestingly, even without Mo Williams, LeBron completely deferred all point guard duties to Matthew Dellavedova, even when the game was somewhat in the balance. His offensive approach was patient without much LeIso. He was focused on D and grabbed a throwback rebound over the top in a crucial situation.
We’ll learn how David Blatt approaches a game he really doesn’t want to lose. (You really don’t want to lose two games in a row to a fellow central division playoff foe) Does he lean heavily on LeBron? Does he go extended periods without substituting? The Cavs responded to adversity last season by dramatically shortening their rotation. Will that be Blatt’s modus operandi or will he show some Popovichian chops this season and defiantly strut out “heat check lineups” and such?
Blatt rode a heat check lineup through the 3rd quarter and watched an 18-point lead whittle to five without any panic substitutions. Both LeBron and Love played just 35 minutes despite the Cavs being more shorthanded than usual. Blatt dusted off Varejao who rewarded some very vocal fan-favoritism with 4-4 shooting and a water-treading +1 in 11 minutes of action.
Disciplined.
Suffice it to say, I was very pleased with how the Cavs responded to the 2-game losing streak. The survived a fairly frightening performance from Giannis: 33 points on 12-15 from the field and 8-8 from the line. Delly ran the offense admirably for 40 minutes, notching a career-best 13 dimes. J.R. Smith provided the offensive firepower that makes him such a potent X-factor: 18 points on 12 shots. Basically, the Cavs stars (Love and LeBron) played like all-stars, their X-Factor played like an X-Factor, and their backup point guard kept the offense humming. Even Jared Cunningham, Free Throw enthusiast, got to put his mark on the contest (5-6 FT). TT had another day at the office: double double on better than 70% shooting. Basically, everyone played his role to perfection on offense (everyone except Mozgov earned an assist) and they survived on D.
Cavs are the best in the league at 70s night pic.twitter.com/HQLDf9zpcW
— Will Gibson (@wjcgibson) November 20, 2015
1st Quarter:
The Cavs spread the ball around nicely. Delly tallied six assists without a turnover and J.R. Smith splashed a few deep ones. James Jones scored the Cavs’ last 8 points of the quarter. Giannis scored 12 on a variety of moves: spin moves in the post, back-door cuts, and even a cross-over pull-up. The Cavs seemed more eager than usual to run off rebounds and go right at the Bucks front line. 28-23 Cavs after 1.
2nd Quarter:
The Cavs bench actually outscored the Bucks while LeBron rested. They made a point to get Kevin Love the ball in some favorable positions. I’ve seen Love seal his defender in the post more already this season than all of last year. The Cavs offense was just humming this quarter. They were overpassing and moving the ball from side to side. They pushed in transition and got easy buckets, and Kevin Love stuck a couple 3s. Tristan Thompson scored 9 points in the quarter and they were: Layup, Dunk, And-1 Layup, Dunk. Perfect. The Cavs hung 35 on the Bucks. They pushed the lead to 21 before ending the half on a brain fart: 63-48 Cavs.
Dellavedova's 9 assists and 1 turnover in 1st half gives him 67/17 on season (3.94). Good for 3rd best ratio in NBA #Cavs
— Brendan Bowers (@BowersCLE) November 20, 2015
3rd Quarter:
The Bucks made some adjustments at halftime. They capitalized in transition on some Cavalier turnovers. They bullied their way to the basket and even stroked a few of the outside shots that would otherwise betray them all night. Blatt stuck with his heat check lineup (no LeBron or Love) down the stretch even as the Bucks kept closing.
4th Quarter:
This game slowed to a halt with all the 4th quarter free throws. The Cavs got into the bonus around the 9 minute mark and kept the Bucks at bay with a steady diet of free throws from normally non-shooting fouls. Credit the Cavs for forcing the action south of the free throw line. Kevin Love was sealing and backing down his defenders and LeBron took every opportunity to draw contact on dribble drives. Delly hit a much-needed 3 early in the quarter, pushing the Cavs lead to 10.
It's so weird to say it but Matthew Dellavedova is a fourth quarter player.
— Eric Knappenberger (@CavsWITNESS) November 20, 2015
They never saw it dip below eight after that. J.R. Smith had a sweet spin-move layup and then the dagg3r on a nice feed from LeBron.
David Blatt on if him ripping the Cavs in Wednesday's film session helped tonight: "It's not about what I said, it's about what they did"
— Dave McMenamin (@mcten) November 20, 2015
Final Thoughts:
For being shorthanded (lost Mozgov mid game too) and playing a fairly decent team, the Cavs put on a good show for the National audience. Fifty-six percent shooting and a 75% assist rate is good offense. The Cavs made their free throws and their open 3s tonight. They responded to every major criticism that could have been lobbed at them during the recent 2-game losing streak.
In transition, what they Cavs lack (just slightly) in raw athleticism they make up for with very effective passing. Kevin Love, Richard Jefferson, even Delly – these guys are pretty effective at rewarding the trailers and finding good transition PUJITs (also PU3ITs). I know LeBron said the Cavs are “too nice”, implying they need to play with more of an edge. I wonder if they need to play faster, and open up the floor a bit more. Maybe this will take care of itself when Kyrie gets back and Mozgov gets right. They rank near the bottom in pace and forced turnovers. And despite that they are 5th in fast break points per game and also 5th in not giving up fast break points to opponents. So that’s excellent. Maybe their style and pace suits them perfectly, it’s hard to say yet. Regardless of the pace, emphasizing overpassing and developing chemistry (especially among the 7th through 12th man) could go a long way towards ensuring another deep playoff run.
A lot of teams have front office decision demons. The one dominating the Bucks is the decision to trade Brandon Knight for Michael Carter-Williams. MCW really cannot shoot the ball. The Bucks front court, on the other hand, is scary and extremely young. If Giannis, Monroe, and Parker stick together for a while the Bucks could make some noise.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGKP6_2CHbs&feature=youtu.be
Parting Shot:
Hilarious Flop of the night:
John Henson's majestic flop looks like he got hit with an invisible cannon ball https://t.co/wYaa3WHl7s pic.twitter.com/YowKvlXuU0
— tim cato (@tim_cato) November 20, 2015
It’s starting to feel like I spend every Cavs game fighting with Cavs fans over Matthew Dellavedova (and to a lesser extent, Anderson Varejao). I’ve never seen a more polarizing player with zero off-court issues. I’ve seen this phenomenon flummox the Cavs’ beat writers who get all the mail and tweets asking “why the hell someone that sucks as much as Delly plays at all!” I’ve been trying to find basketball culture’s Higgs-Boson. I know it’s there, it has to be there, because there has to be something that I can name that is causing these wildly divergent perceptions. I think I’m onto it. But, as part of my research, I could use your help. Please fill out the following survey in the comments section.
1.) On a scale of 1-10, one being Manu Ginobili and 10 being Johnny Manziel, how under or over-rated is Matthew Dellavedova?
2.) Is Delly a good defensive player? What makes you say that?
3.) Does Delly makes the players around him better, or do the players around him elevate Delly? Or is that a biased question because Delly isn’t “elevated” at all he just sucks?
4.) Is Delly a better offensive player than Iman Shumpert?
5.) On a scale of 1-10, one being Bill Lambier, and 10 being Pau Gasol, how “dirty” is Delly?
Sound off!
I do think Cavs fans over value Cavs players. I remember not wanting to part with like, JJ Hickson. And being excited about Omri Casspi. So it’s hard to trust myself as I answer these questions. 1.) On a scale of 1-10, one being Manu Ginobili and 10 being Johnny Manziel, how under or over-rated is Matthew Dellavedova? Let’s go 4. A bit underrated, generally speaking. 2.) Is Delly a good defensive player? What makes you say that? F Yeah. Just look at how he frustrates dudes (granted that is a combination of his effort and his defense). 3.) Does… Read more »
I think a big part of the Delly’s toughness and style comes from his past as a rugby player. Diving for balls, being very physical and hard-nosed. It helps to envision what it would look like if a rugby player got transplanted to a basketball court.
Delly survey: 1) On overrated, underrated, Delly is a 3. His detractors (and these are the dumb basketball people in this discussion) think he sucks and under-rate him (10’s). He’s a 40% 3PT shooter (close to it) for his career and has an excellent assist/TO ration (top 5 in league) and plays pesky defense. What else do you want from your backup PG. These folk think if you can’t jump high or break people down off the dribble all the time, you aren’t good as basketball. But their perception is off. Delly’s supporters, for the most part, are pretty clear-eyed.… Read more »
Reggie is jealous he still can’t play & insults many to his delight.
Interesting read on “How to beat the Warriors” Deadspin http://deadspin.com/so-how-are-you-supposed-to-beat-the-warriors-1743700099
East has definitely had a group of team overtake their counterparts in the west this season. Let’s hope cavs can be healthy by January to show they are better too.
Spurs lost and look like garbage. Knicks beat a Durantless OKC. DAMN IT Warriors won again! Bulls kept it close and then that 3rd min mark, they sprinted the lead. More bragging about that small ball lineup that beat the Cavs again. Rose would have made a difference. But that Bulls bench is just horrible. Overall, they didn’t seem as physical as Thibs had when he coached them.
Phenomenal recap.
@uninterrupted: It’s on. @KingJames accepts @Money23Green’s bet on #OSUvsMSU https://t.co/M1GTRxRdse https://t.co/mAndsaTtX9
PER THE J.R. RUMOR —IF FOUND GUILTY WHAT / HOW DOES THE NBA DISCILPLINE AND / OR WHAT DO THE CAVS DO ?–JUST SEEMS LIKE ALOT OF ” HURDLES ” FOR THE CAVS TO OVERCOME SO FAR THIS EARLY SEASON —– IF THE SEASON ENDED TODAY BASED ON PLAYERS PERFORMANCES WHO DO YOU GIVE THE BIGGER CONTRACT TO –DELLY OR MOZ —ALSO THINK WHENEVER THY PULL THE HAYWOOD CONTRACT TRADE DOESN’T MATTER IF THEY TRADE FOR A BIG / OR GAURD THEY NEED TO GO AFTER AN ATHLETIC BODY / PLAYER
Per his lawyer, there hasn’t been any charges filed. I would hope the NBA would afford him due process if charges would be filed.
I hope Irving and Shump are healthy by Christmas so much. That will be a treat. If Love can reasonably defend Green or Barnes and if Thompson can punish Barnes when he tries to guard him the Cavs should win. I will have nightmares though of Love and Irving defending a Curry Green screen. But if they try and play with Green as their center all game Irving and James will get to the rack all night
I don’t think Love can handle Green. It has to be Thompson. As much as I’d love to win on Christmas, I’m not going to be overly concerned if we don’t. Even if Irving is healthy, he’s unlikely to be in great shape and should be on a pitch count. In fact, I’m not all that bothered by the fact they are winning so much and they seem to be thinking they can win 73. I don’t think they can, but if they are going for that, it adds extra pressure and stress to their season. They’ve been on overdrive… Read more »
I pulling for them to go undefeated till Christmas. They are going to emotionally exhaust themselves chasing 73. And if it goes off the rails at some point could lead to chemistry issues
The Warriors small ball unit might be getting all the attention but the Cavs Mo Delly Lebron Love TT lineup is blowing them out of the water on a per minute basis
Well I don’t know how ‘exhausted’ they’ll be. Lebron plays more mpg than Steph, and Love plays more than Green. No one else plays 32 mpg on either team.
As far as emotionally exhausted, I’m not sure how you measure that. Sure looks like they are having a blast when they play though.
I remember a couple years ago when Miami went on a twenty game tear in Febuary they started caring about the streak and exhausted themselves. I’m hoping something like that happens. Maybe it doesn’t but in that case it just doesn’t matter
1.) 5 – Delly is properly rated, except by Cols and a vocal minority (the same type of vocal minority who say LBJ sucks because “Michael Jordan”. 2.) Delly is a great defensive player. Advanced metrics, for one. 2 – play that is too advanced for metrics, such as goading technicals, frustrated lapses, ejections, and getting guys off rhythm. 3 – excellent team defense and understanding of scheme, help assignments 4 – effort, which is what most good defense comes from and which is contagious (and part of why his +/- is always so good). 5 – Steph Curry finals.… Read more »
Wow. Excellent post
Thank you very much. Delly gets me excited. I’m a strange man.
St. Weirdo made the Shaqtin’ A Fool segment last night…
Instead of talking Delly, some observations about LBJ last night: 1. LBJ walked the walk, after talking the talk. The biggest thing that jumped out at me was his rebounding. LBJ was a major reason why CLE was dominant on the boards… Rebounding is all about desire, and LBJ let it be known that’s how he was going to show his hustle. 2. His offensive efficiency and masterful orchestration. What stuck out in the 4th quarter was how he repeatedly went to the same play where they would run a PnR to get Love a mismatch, and Love would post-up… Read more »
LBJ also led the team in rebounding last post-season. Dude is amazing.
Also, at one point in the fourth quarter there was a stat that went up stating that LeBron had passed the ball 19 straight times without taking a shot… the ultimate in sharing the ball, especially in crunch time. Sort of an anti-Le-ISO…
Loved the fact that they had 29 assists on 40 made buckets… and that they almost doubled up the Bucks in rebounding (43-22)…
Great point, I had forgotten about that stat they had mentioned during the broadcast. Another good on about moving the ball in crunch time. The only LBJ isos I remember were the last two possessions, and LBJ did it intentionally to make sure they killed the clock all the way down to zero on the shot clock.
Amazing assist and rebounding statistics… holding MIL’s front court to 22 rebounds?! They should be embarrassed by that.
I never heard DWade say that about LeBron but that comment holds a lot of weight to me. That’s something I’ll be keeping an eye out for this season, how much Leb’s on-court “trust” in his teammates appears to continue evolving.
Considering that Wade and Bosh missed almost every shot they took in that series I don’t think LeBron was wrong to not trust them.
This was in reference to the last Finals, what do you mean Wade and Bosh missed every shot?
DWade said it when he was a guess commentator for the Finals coverage. He said it during a halftime analysis, and I remember it well because DWade offered an insightful criticism even though LBJ was playing so well. It holds a lot of weight to me as well, considering their friendship. You can tell the trust is growing among the whole team. Now that they’ve been through some battles, everybody’s earning each other’s trust. You can tell LBJ trusts everyone more, and he knows he has to if they’re going to be successful as a team, and him as a… Read more »
“Instead of talking Delly, some observations about LBJ last night” YES !!! Now you’re talking!! @ EvilGenius did not know that stat on Lebron 19 times. Cool. And I will vouch for CLF. I heard Wade say that also when he commented in Finals coverage.
Jason Lloyd @JasonLloydABJ 28m28 minutes ago
Jason Lloyd Retweeted New York Daily News
Well this is … interesting:
New York Daily News @NYDailyNews
EXCLUSIVE: JR Smith is accused of choking a 19-year-old student near a Chelsea pizza shop. http://nydn.us/1N0w5B6
It says he wasn’t arrested, but JR out late in NYC is never a good idea…
Apparently, he also was playing with a broken thumb earlier this season…
http://www.ohio.com/sports/cavs/cavaliers-notebook-j-r-smith-s-injuries-including-broken-bone-he-never-knew-he-had-healing-up-1.641931
1) Delly is severly underrated. I’d call it a 2 just because I’m not sure how underrated Manu is. But I think that Delly is a top 30 point guard and most people see him as a bit player. It was way worse but the finals has made it better but no where close to enough. 2) He’s an excellent defender. I haven’t noticed him getting beaten by big guards. I saw him man up and play Affallo tight the other night in crunch time. I saw him do a nice job on MCW last night despite playing 40 minutes.… Read more »
Sigh. This is so not needed. Delly is a decent rotational guard. He’s not good in the sense of he should start or even be the first PG off the bench, but as a guy who can play some point and some SG and give quality minutes when needed he’s a totally fine option. 1. NBA-wise, properly rated. CtB wise – tremendously overrated. He’s not one of the 10 most important Cavs to winning it all. To put it in perspective, he’s averaging 6 points and 5 assists in 25 minutes a game, that’s not good. But it’s fine as… Read more »
This was great. I love the line: “I don’t know what he does besides get the ball barely beyond half court in time and pass as soon as he can.”
Seems odd that a guy averaging 11 assists per 48 doesn’t drive and dish? Or maybe he does frequently and you are just ignoring it
He doesn’t drive and dish very often at all. What are you talking about? He swings the ball around really well, but driving and passing? Nope.
He drives and dishes several times a game. Every Tristan oop is a drive and dish and he is pretty adept at hitting the cornor man behind Tristan if his man slid over to help on the oop.
So one drive and dish a game? I think this qualifies as not very freaking often. If you think Delly is constantly driving to the hoop then I have no idea which number you think Delly is on the court? Hint, it’s not #23.
I know there are stats for this. Can Evil or Tom look up how many drives delly has a game? I don’t think he’s Lebron or Irving but he goes to the hole a decent percentage. More than JR or Mo
Dude. Stop. Mo is averaging 15 points on a really good TS% and 5 assists in barely more minutes than Delly. Delly is not better than Mo.
Ugh.
I said they drive to the hole the same amount. Mo never goes to the rack. He takes pull ups. I think they are about the same once you factor in defense
Mo gets past his man and buries the jumper quite often. His shoooting is very very good. That counts you know. I don’t see how anyone can watch a game of baskebtall and think the offense flows better with Delly dragging the ball past the halfcourt line and passing immediately to what Mo brings.
And yet, the ball moved better on offense than it has all season with Delly in there… that’s not a coincidence…
40% of the time Delly’s used possessions end in an assist. Thats absurd. You can’t do that just swinging the ball around the perimeter. http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics/_/league/east/sort/assistRatio The reason people say it flows better is be is because of things like that in about the same amount of minutes we out score teams by 14 points per 48 with Delly and 7 with Mo despite that Mo plays more minutes with LBJ and Love. Then you look at the individual line ups and the stats bear out what people are saying that Mo and Delly are about the same or that the… Read more »
Sorry for the grammar. Going back and forth between links screwed me up a bit. 40% of the time Delly’s used possessions end in an assist. Thats absurd. You can’t do that just swinging the ball around the perimeter. http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics/_/league/east/sort/assistRatio The reason people say it flows better is be is because of things like this; in about the same amount of minutes the Cavs out score teams by 14 points per 48 with Delly and 7 with Mo despite that Mo plays more minutes with LBJ and Love. According to Real plus minus at BBR Then you look at the… Read more »
I appreciate anyone digging into the stats like this. I’m sure it took you a couple of hours to put it together mainly because both of those websites are slow and horrible at downloading info. It’s interesting and good to know. It’ll be fun to pull up these stats when Kyrie gets back. Mr 4th Quarter!!
How did he get “abused” last night? Neither MCW nor Bayless even hit double digits (both scored 9). Sure they got some handoffs to big men for a few buckets, and it might not have been Delly’s best defensive effort, but those guys both scored 17 in the last game against the Cavs when Mo was starting…
To use your format… on defense, Delly is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mo…
You know, i hate citing stats, but here you go
Mo Williams 2015 ORtg 115 DRtg 104
Most overrated player ever by CtB ORtg 108 DRtg 104
So Mo is much better on offense and the same on defense. Which you would also know if you went by the eye test. But hey, keep on believing whatever you need to believe.
Dude, if you think Mo is better on defense based on eye-test, then you seriously need to stop smokin so much of the green…
All you need to do is go back and watch the Detroit game to see how absolutely TORCHED Mo got…
Not disagreeing that Mo is the superior offensive player, but there is no question Delly is the superior defensive player, and I’d bet you are the only one who would disagree…
Enjoy your own altered reality… sigh…
This get skewed by the minutes that Delly plays with the scrubs at the end of blow outs. Better to check wow similiar units perform with both players and Delly destroys Mo in those comparisons.
Theres also this. Best non Warrior in real plus minus with at least 300 minutes played… Delly
Per 48 minutes sorry. He’s 9th overall though.
The tiny URL for your query is:
http://bkref.com/tiny/ANFe4
You are bringing it, Rodney
He’s Baaaaaaaack!
What the?! Eye-test? Fam put down the pipe.
Ummm Cols your stats are off.
Mo 2015 ORtg 107.4 DRtg 101.9 = +5.5
Most beloved player in the known Universe ORtg 104.8 DRtg 92.5 = +12.3
Awesome recap Tom! Jam packed to bursting with good stuff… and you probably could have created a whole other piece for the Delly questions… My two cents on them… 1.) On an NBA or national level, Delly is appropriately rated. We tend to overrate him a bit in this community because it’s fun to watch a guy like him hustle for this team. 2.) He’s a solid defensive player, and there are times when he is capable of excellence (the two games he guarded Curry like a blanket in the Finals, or when he takes on larger big men in… Read more »
Gotta Love (pun intended) the effort last night. Down 4 “core” players for most of the game and winning by 15 shows the talent, depth, and grit our team has.
More injury news… gonna be seeing more of Andy and Sasha…
I think it’s conspicuously suspicious that Cols has not weighed in on the questions… Mostly because I can’t believe he has this much restraint when it comes to answering poll questions about his favorite punching bag…
Busy with stuff.
Is that code for “busy writing my anti-Delly manifesto”? ;)
Magic 8-Ball says an epic reply is forthcoming from Cols……….
I’m so, so tired of the injury bug. Can it just move on to another team already. 3 of 5 starters…
I don’t think it hurts at all to lose Mozzy against the Hawks, as he’s a bad matchup for Horoford. Same for Mo, as Lord knows nobody wanted to see the carnage of Mo having to guard and keep Schroeder out of the paint (especially with no Mozzy rim protection).
Great article… This list is an awesome idea. I don’t post much, but this looks like fun. I’ve been a huge Delly fan since watching the first summer league games with him in a Cavs uniform. The reason I love Delly is that it is just so much fun watching him play. I’m doing this before reading any other comments, so sorry if I duplicate any ideas. 1.) On a scale of 1-10, one being Manu Ginobili and 10 being Johnny Manziel, how under or over-rated is Matthew Dellavedova? I’d say perception of Delly has changed over the years so… Read more »
Really thoughtful response Dave! Glad you contributed!
Mo is out for a couple more games.
Moz out for 2 weeks.
Has anyone noticed Mo Williams now un-ironically looks like his 70’s character from several years ago?
I don’t think that a lot of basketball people don’t like Delly, but a few loud and clueless people do.
The thing about Delly is playing way above what his physical talent level is. In that sense he is like Larry Bird. Bird is surely in the top 50 players of all time. But the other 49 are much better athletes than he is. Being that good as a modestly tall slow guy is what makes Bird something special.
Bird was a top flight athlete until his back gave out.
Words that should never be in the same sentence as Larry Bird: flight and athlete
He was never really like a cut looking dude though… always seemed a little doughy and soft… plus he had that awful stache…
Yes. But he was extremely athletic.
For a hick from French Lick…
You do realize that George Mikan, Dolph Schayes, and Dave Debusschere are in the NBA’s top 50 right?
Wow! Thought I was the old guy around here. Good point though.
Yea I been around. Started following Cavs in 81-82, and really got into it when World got there. It’s a shame his number isn’t retired. He did a lot for the team and helped save them from the owner who shall not be named.
This is a great write-up .I was looking forward to reading this. I appreciate the obvious diligence in recapping each quarter. The pics are fantastic. I honestly don’t know how you put up with those kind of annoying questions when you are just trying to enjoy the game and what each player has brought to the game. It’s just that those questions that are negative in nature kinda took over the dialogue over the kick ass game the Cavs brought being down 4 players. It was amazing resilience and adjustments that were remarkable. Andy reminded everyone he can bring points… Read more »
Personally, I have always taken the view on Delly that I overrate his ability level based on his effort level. But even Cols can admit Delly’s made some significant strides since last season. He is noticeably more confident. His ball handling is much better. He shoots with more confidence. His stroke is a bit more refined. He’s going to his floater intentionally this year. Plus he still is one of the best irritants in the NBA at the guard spot. His defense just flat out annoys other players. He works hard, plays hard, has a great attitude, and plays above… Read more »
1.) I agree with TaxiMike – this question depends on the audience. I think CTB overrates him. I think lots of other underrate him. 2.) Delly is a very good defensive point guard. Just watch the Finals and his work on Curry. Case closed. I wouldn’t call him elite because I reserve that for the people like Pippen, LBJ, Iggy, Ron Harper etc. who can guard 3-4 positions. 3.) Delly executes the system really well, which is enough for him to help his teammates on the 2nd team outplay other 2nd teams. In the Finals, though, when KI was out… Read more »
Fun reading these comment. I like this site. 1. 5? I feel like the general perception of Delly is that he is a gritty, hard-working guy who is maximizing every ounce of talent he has. Sounds about right to me. I’ve always been just super confused about the Delly hate. I’m starting to believe that it has something to do with athleticism, honestly. KLove gets some of the same hate sometimes. Athletic players just “look” good. They look fluid, they make us “oooooo” and “aaaaaa”. Delly will never make us do that. He is not athletic (compared to other NBA… Read more »
I think you’ve nailed it with point 1 – this is what I have been thinking since reading the recap yesterday. Example of this – Delly brings the ball down the floor with his conspicuous handle, which becomes more conspicuous when his opponent picks him up. It doesn’t look pretty, it’s a loping quazimodo-esque style. It’s not what the prettiest handlers in the league look like, dancing & spinning their way into attack. But look where the ball is when he has it at this point – it’s nowhere near the opponent, and he knows exactly where his teammates are.… Read more »
These questions are annoying from one dimensional minds incapable of educating themselves from facts, stats, but mostly from front runners with loud mouths wanting the controversy. “Look at me on how outrageously insulting my remarks can be just so I can get you to notice me” All that matters is what Lebron & Blatt KNOW about Delly, Iman, and Andy. Everything else on the matter is just noise.
Noticed your remark, so it must work …
It’s never about my remark or even yours. We don’t matter. What matters is Lebron & Blatt. They have the last say. It is working for them! ;)
Uh. So we should just close down the site?
Aren’t we hear to talk about these things in a fun environment? Isn’t that a part of being a fan?
So someone disagrees you automatically exaggerate they want to close down the sight? That’s a logical conclusion. These are not basketball questions. Sure they are fun for the trolls today. By all means , enjoy! No one is stopping anyone from doing that.
site not sight for grammar
Huh? What would be an example of a basketball question then?
I drew my “logical conclusion” because you said “These question are annoying…ALL that matters is what the team knows…our remarks don’t matter.” So, uh, if our remarks don’t matter about players, then what could we talk about that does matter?
Seriously, if we can’t talk about the players, what would we talk about that does matter?
These questions in how they are worded are not basketball questions; they are designed to insult. They compare non-basketball people to basketball people . Then you are to rate a player that isn’t even playing to someone that is. Then there is the dirty player evaluation. They are not basketball questions like. Where are the Cavs pace in the NBA right now? Who in the NBA can defend a player within 4 feet than is not a center? That was a Finals question btw. Where does Tristan rank in offensive rebounds in the Eastern COnference? How many points are allowed… Read more »
More basketball questions many of us enjoy are: Where is Lebron ranking in points in NBA? 4th Where does Love rank in rebs? 3rd Where do Cavs rank in assists? Lebron 16th, Delly 20th. Mo 25th.
I NEVER once said we could not talk about the players.
Won’t be a whole helluva lot of talk if we follow that logic though.
TV63- “Lebron is 4th in points per game this year”
taximike- ” Yup, that’s correct”
EvilGenius- “Yea I saw that at basketball-reference.com.”
Hot Sauce- “I know, that’s a handy website”
Cols- “Lebron would be first in every category if he wanted to”
You can’t go very deep when discussing facts. Opinions on the other hand…….
One of my favorite stats I like to follow is clutch points. How are we doing compared to the rest of the league? Shouldn’t be controversial.
1.) 10 … for what he costs this team in salary + what is role is EXPECTED to be + what his role ACTUALLY EDS UP being … we could not do better. One could argue that he gets Delly minutes + Kyrie minutes + Joe Harris minutes (and last night, + Mo minutes). 2.) Physically, no. He is under-sized and a step slow, and that will catch up to us occasionally. Mentally and effort-wise, yes. You get all he has, every possession. 3.) He makes everyone better. Unfortunately, he continues to chuck it up in lineups when he should… Read more »
1) I’d like to stick up for Johnny for a sec before I answer the question: He was wildly overhyped coming out of the draft process but since everyone has buried him and left him for dead already, I’d say he has become underrated. That said, I’d say Delly is a 6. His offensive improvements have largely gone unnoticed but his assists get pumped up way to much (like TT offensive rebounding imo). Good perimeter defender but struggles against taller players and in the post. Little too much hype for his D and assist to TO ratio, not enough hype… Read more »
Even though I missed this one, glad to see the team responding to LeBron’s/Blatt’s pleas with some urgency as opposed to last year. Also, can’t get enough of the 70’s Cavs (fun fact, the guy you retweeted, Will Gibson, a writer at WFNY, works at the same office as me!). 1.) Depends who you ask but I’ll say 3. Basketball people and fans who follow the Cavs generally appreciate the value Delly brings to the team, but a lot of Cavs fans also seem to hate the guy so there are polarizing reactions. The majority of NBA followers and Americans,… Read more »
Great point about chalmers.Delly USA much better player than any point guard the heat ever had. He’s the same level as Mo
1. 8 – if going by this blog, he’s overrated. He’s only talked about nationally as it relates to his perceived dirtiness. He averages 6 points and 5 assists on high minutes, yet some would have you believe he’s in the running for MVP. 2. He is mostly an average defender who plays with great energy and hustle. He CANNOT guard bigger guards and it’s not like you can throw him on the other teams best player and he’ll shut him down. Don’t over think this, he hustles well but his actual defense is average. 3. Boobie Gibson, Sasha pavlovic,… Read more »
1. Overall 3. Too many people who watch NBA still have no appreciation for the little things he does which help a team win (See point 3). The playoffs last year will have done a bit to rectify that but there are still tons of box score watchers out there. 2. Like others have said he is good but not elite. Effort gets you a long way defensively so he is certainly way above league average defensively just due to that. 3. He makes the team better by his ability to work well with seemingly everyone he’s on court with.… Read more »
Love your response to 3…
These responses have been disarming. Maybe the average Cavs fans has it about right and I’m just letting a few trolls color my perspective…
Or maybe the Cavs:TheBlog community is just an extremely well-informed and reasonable fan community.
I think your average Cavs fan is usually well informed and realistic about Delly — a strong rotation player who can start for stretches and run a 2nd unit offense. As an undrafted, “unathletic” white guy from Australia, he’s exceeded expectations 1000x since breaking into Mike Brown’s rotation, and that’s why a blue-collar, underdog fanbase like Cleveland loves to hype him so much. The issue is just people underrating him so much he becomes overrated, and then vice versa.
Finally, someone said it! As Andy Baskins said from The Fan 92.3. “Delly RAN THE OFFENSE SO LEBRON DOESN’T HAVE TO” . This is first and foremost responsibilty of a point guard. He suppose to get alot of assists! And it’s his job to move the ball. Traditionally a point guard isn’t suppose to get or expected to get 40 pts a game. This is why you have lethal shooters. And News Flash! We DO!! Mathematically, your options of passing & moving the ball are more fluent with Delly getting the ball to the other “VERY GOOD SHOOTERS” we have… Read more »
1.) 5 – it seems he’s overrated but he just gets more publicity because he plays with LeBron
2.) Above average defender. He’s got quick feet and excellent anticipation (from high defensive IQ?). He gives all out effort every play.
3.) He plays like a pass first point guard.
4.) Shump has better 1on1 skills and more bounce but Delly gets his teammates better looks.
5.) 10 – people call him dirty b/c disrespect his talent and allude his hustle as dirty. Everyone wants a Delly on their team.
Good writeup, before I answer the Delly Query, I think this game was a nearly flawless win. The flaw being that the Cavs still turn it over too much. But Lebron, Blatt, the team did everything right while facing a Bucks team that didn’t want to go away. The AV we saw tonight is the perfect balance to TT and Moz. You can basically leave those 2 alone at mid-range. The Bucks seemed to forget that he can shoot and he had easy shoot-around-type buckets. Pulling him off the bench in the playoffs to can 8-9 important points would be… Read more »
I’ll qualify my “AV worth the money” by saying he’s worth it on the Cavs. With the amount they committed he’s a good fit at that price. On the 76ers he’d be a colossal waste.
1. Delly is Manu underrated. He’s making the right play now and is able to with his skill set. He’s also a wonderful talker on defense. He’s constantly communicating which is a very underrated attribute. 2. Delly has limitations and he uses heady fouls and the defensive scheme to mask them. He’s also always talking. 3. Delly does elevate guys because he keeps everyone involved. He will pass up a shot to get someone else involved and he takes what’ he’s given, nothing more, noting less. 4. I would say he is better than Iman right now, but Iman has… Read more »
I realize the Cavs were shorthanded, but I think Coach Blatt stuck with JJ far too long. Giannis was abusing him. I realize he is a huge matchup problem to begin with, but with him being much younger, taller, and quicker it wasn’t a fair fight.
This is from last year but it was amusing at the time and is still funny/relevant a year later.
I don’t know if anyone who is authorized can put Gif’s up but if not here’s the link.
http://tinyurl.com/nrj2mbh
1. Rated by who? Media? Trolls? Fanboys? Seems to be pegged right by the local media, and from listening to a lot of opponent’s announcers on streams this year, he is mostly being portrayed as a key cog of the team/bench. Don’t recall anyone saying he was dirty, but they do call him pesky etc. 2. Good. Metrics say he’s good, and he passes eye test as well. Nowhere close to shutdown or elite, but he’ll get in your chest and fight to get through screens with the best of em, and rebounds well for his position/size. Plays well vs… Read more »
The shorts needed to be much shorter and the socks much taller.
Awesome screen name btw…
Should rename this site Delly: The Blog.
Today it will wind up that way. Such an exciting game last night but this is what the majority of comments will be on instead. So much to talk about on so many other players that made a difference in the game.
Or Cavs: The Bloggavedova…
I’m still waiting for my weekly Delly Counter column
1. I’d say 5. I’ve learned to appreciate what he brings and not to expect too much from that. But I’m not gonna be surprised on performances like say 20pts 12ast in a game or two. its not impossible for a workhorse like him. 2. He’s good. Not elite but good. Though I don’t think he would make an all defensive team in his prime. 3. I don’t think he makes teammates better ala Lebron or Nash, but he makes the output of this team better because he always contributes one way or another. Regardless of the cast he’s with… Read more »
Delly channeling inner Austin Powers right there. Hilarious photo. The team responded very well with the first hurdle. Everyone brought up good contributions. Kevin Love played like how he should be majority of the time and was felt in the entirety of the game. Now just playing consistently like that (which is not far fetched) and we’ll be more monster, when Kyrie returns, than last year. JR finally out of the slump these past two games. But I don’t like the foul in closing the first half, well JR be JR. Delly is a mini Andy. Just always giving something… Read more »
Sounds like Timo will be out 10 days to two weeks with a deltoid injury…
Unleash the trolls!!
What I hate is when any blog writer or analyst makes a judgment about a player pre-season and then sticks with that opinion in spite of evidence. That is what is happening to some of those guys at FTS. Andy is valuable and much better the then thought he would be but they refuse to admit it. So now we have two players that people just have their opinions about and no amount of evidence can seem to change their minds. Smh…
1) Hard to answer, he’s both overrated and underrated. So I’ll say ‘5’ 2) He’s a good defensive player for his size and athleticism. He stays between his man and the basket pretty consistently, and he always gives good effort. He gets abused by taller guards, or skilled guys who can just shoot over him. 3) I think he makes the team better to an extent. He’s always trying to get other guys shots. He’s pretty limited in getting offense for himself, of course, so at times he makes the team worse because he adds little shotmaking himself. 4) Tough… Read more »
Oops, didn’t intend that as a reply to KJ, just a comment to the post.
Because of Andy’s injury history it’s easy for them to write him off. I mean even Kobe never came back the same right? But then again what I think they don’t understand (or refuse to accept) is that Andy doesn’t necessarily need to be what he was on his prime. Nobody is asking him to play 35 mins a night . Hardwork and energy (and underrated IQ) has always been his foundation. He will always have something positive to give despite reduced mins.
Don’t care what anyone else says… Andy will always be one of my favorite Cavs…
KJ – I hate that you’re not a regular around here any more. Come back to us!
Great point Kj… and second Tom’s request for your return as a regular!