The Road to Contention, Part III: LEEEROY JENKINS!
2018-08-08I know. This title dates me. The 2005 World of Warcraft video that documented Leeroy abandoning his guildmates and crashing headlong into the fray only to result in the slaughter of his guild, is however emblematic of the type of teambuilding the Cavs could engage in: a win now, and win at all costs mentality. This is the kind of strategy the Knicks embraced in building around ‘Melo and Amare Stoudemire. Isn’t this the strategy that the Cavs have been engaged in over the last four years you ask? Well, not really.
I’d argue that ole CavsDan hit the breaks on this strategy last year when he started collecting guys he viewed as long term assets, like Larry Nance, Rodney Hood, and the draft pick that became Collin Sexton. Even yesterday, the Cavs added Wisconsin’s Sam Dekker who has had a lackluster three years in the NBA so far, but posted a not abysmal RPM of -1.46 despite a sub 20% three ball. Still, the Cavs have a few things up their sleeve that would allow them to roll the dice and get more competitive now.
First off, they have the George Hill contract. While it seemed like expiring contracts were useless for a while, there are a lot of teams up against the cap again. Miami, Minnesota, Portland, Detroit, and Memphis all faxing big payrolls for the next two years, and Miami and Portland don’t seem to have much cap relief in site and are above the $123.7 million dollar tax apron. Unfortunately, the Cavs didn’t move quickly enough to trade Okaro White and his non guaranteed $1.5 million dollar contract to help another team clear their cap.
Still there are a lot of moves the Cavs could pull off now or at the trade deadline to make their team better in the short term, damn the torpedoes, let the chips fall where they may, and realize some other Quixotic metaphors.
Scenario 1: The Miami Connection: As has been publicly discussed, Miami seems to be making just about everyone not named Justice Winslow available in trade talks: Dion Waiters, Tyler Johnson, Hassan Whiteside… If a guy has a contract over eight figures per year, my bet is Miami would trade him for cap relief. In fact, things are so desperate, there are talks of them flipping Tyler Johnson for Houston’s contract albatross, Ryan Anderson, just to save some tax dollars. Crazy.
So why not just make the trade? In this move, the Cavs get a lot of guys who can help them now, Justice Winslow, and a draft pick for the future. Why are they getting a draft pick for the future? Because this move gets Miami out of cap hell by saving themselves $27 million next season.
Larry Nance, if he can perfect a corner three ball can play next to Whiteside or Love, and would be a great high-low combo with either. Tyler Johnson is a better player than Jordan Clarkson, and if last season is to be believed, JR Smith and Tristan Thompson have nothing to offer anyone.
Taking a look inside RPM, this move equals about nine more wins for the Cavs next season, if RPM is to be believed, and Dion’s return doesn’t prove deleterious. Also could be more if Whiteside can return to his former form and Winslow can improve offensively.
Player | 17-18 RPM | 17-18 Wins | 16-17 RPM | 16-17 Wins | 15-16 RPM | 15-16 Wins |
Miami | ||||||
Hassan Whiteside | 0.5 | 3.2 | 2 | 8.2 | 1.43 | 6 |
Tyler Johnson | -0.5 | 3.5 | 0.3 | 4.7 | -0.9 | 1.2 |
James Johnson | 1.4 | 5.5 | 2.4 | 7.3 | -1.6 | 0.9 |
Dion Waiters | -3.1 | 0 | 0 | 2.8 | -1.9 | 1.8 |
Justice Winslow | 0.3 | 3.6 | -3.9 | -0.3 | -0.9 | 3.1 |
TOTAL | -1.4 | 15.8 | 0.8 | 22.7 | -3.87 | 13 |
Cleveland | ||||||
George Hill | 0.5 | 4.1 | 3.8 | 6.3 | 1 | 6.6 |
Tristan Thompson | -3.8 | -0.5 | 0 | 4.6 | 1.4 | 6.3 |
J.R. Smith | -2.3 | 1.2 | -1.3 | 1.4 | 1.3 | 6.5 |
Jordan Clarkson | -1.8 | 1.6 | -4 | -1.4 | -2.4 | 1.2 |
TOTAL | -7.4 | 6.4 | -1.5 | 10.9 | 1.3 | 20.6 |
If you really think getting over .500 is a great accomplishment, this trade could probably get you there, especially if Dion returns to the form he showed in 16-17. Also, if you think Justice Winslow could pull a Jimmy Butler and turn into a star in his fourth season, this trade would probably be worth it. The problems with it are numerous if your name isn’t Leeroy Jenkins.
Hassan Whiteside is a headcase who has shown an inability to play consistently intelligent and motivated basketball. Tyler Johnson is a solid 37%+ three point shooter, but James Johnson, Justice Winslow, and Dion Waiters are all wildly inconsistent shooters. James Johnson is a career 30% shooter, and Dion is all over the place peaking at 39% in 16-17. Winslow did shoot 38% from deep last year (but just 28% his rookie year, and 20% in 18 games of his his injury shortened sophomore campaign).
Dion is also injury prone and has missed about half of each of the last two seasons. In addition, He and James Johnson combine to make almost $25 million when the third year of these deals rolls around, putting a significant dent in Cleveland’s 2020 cap space. Finally, these guys put up these numbers under Eric Spoelstra, one of the better coaches in the NBA. What would they do in Cleveland where the coaching is more suspect, and the Cavs have lost arguably their best player development guy in Phil Handy?
From a fit standpoint, this move turns the Cavs into a half court, grind it out team, which is not exactly what you want to put around Collin Sexton. Still, few teams in the league have the size and depth to consistently contend with Love, Nance, and Whiteside in the high and low post all night, and defensive rebounding wouldn’t be an issue. Get a board, outlet to Sexton and let him run and send it to the post if nothing’s there. It’s not a bad offense.
Best case scenario? Dion has an Oladipo like breakout, Hassan gets his head on right, Love feasts on double teams and elbow offense, and James Johnson, Tyler, and Collin harrass everyone defensively. Ultimately, though, the peak on this team might just be a 52 win squad that loses in the second round. A lot would depend on Winslow’s development too, and I’m not sure Miami would give him up, and a draft pick…
Scenario 2, Hotlanta: I’ve been pitching some form of this deal for years. Atlanta clears out Plumlee and Baze from their books in 2019, and Cleveland Gets Dedmon and a protected pick that could some day turn into a gem and a second rounder or two for the savings.
I’m not even sure this deal is an upgrade, since Bazemore is about on par with Hill, and we’d be suddenly seeing a lot more of Jordan Clarkson in point guard duty. The trade machine gives the Cavs four more wins with this deal, and it might be worth it for a pick. Still, that’s not really the point of this article.
Scenario 3: Bring CJ Home. This deal assumes things absolutely blow up early in Portland, they decide to clear the decks, and Paul Allen actually starts to care about how much money his team loses.
This takes a wrecking ball to Portland’s team and actually gives them the ability to sign free agents in 2019 by cutting $34 million off of salaries next year. It also gets them out from under the tax this year (depending on how far into the season they make this trade). To do so, Portland takes on Tristan Thompson (Cleveland probably has to find a third team to take him with a draft pick from Portland). It’s a steep price to pay, taking on $37 million worth of mediocre players next year, but it’s probably worth it if you think CJ McCollum is a star. (I do).
Cleveland gets a big two of Love and McCollum, and hopefully Sexton and Osman round it out into a big four. Meyers Leonard gets a chance to actually play real minutes, and Portland gets rid of some bad contracts. This one is a long shot, but one they should be on the lookout for if things go badly in the Rose Garden
Scenario 4: LeBron James, you is a balla…
but Jimmy Butler is your father. Jimmy Butler could be the best player in the east if he still played there. With a contract option for next summer, Butler knows this, and has been reportedly frustrated with the Wolves’ young guns. You want a swing for the fences deal? How about bringing Butler back east and selling him on teaming up with Kevin Love to get back to the finals? I know. I know. Giving up Cedi (and a first-rounder), and eating Dieng’s deal… But Butler is one of the few players I’d do it for. Butler is probably the most underrated player in the league. No. 4 in RPM at 6.39, just behind Steph Curry, Butler is as good as the Cavs could ever hope to acquire after LeExodus. Could they swing for the fences and get him to re-sign? Boston won’t have a lot of cap room next year, and Toronto is tied up for a while. Don’t think that Philly is watching the Butler situation. That third spot in the east is up for grabs, and a Butler led team could get an Eastern team to the finals.
Scenario 4b, Andrew Wiggins. Andrew’s five year, $147.5 million dollar extension inked last fall already looks like a massive overpay for a guy who can’t post better than a -1.6 RPM. Wiggins posted the worst TS of his career last year at 51%, despite dialing back his shots from 26 to 22 per game. His splits are pretty awful at 44%/33%/64% from the field, three, and the line. Yet, he takes a whopping 5.7 threes a game. If the Wolves are ready to give up on him, bringing him back to Cleveland could be done for the trade above for ‘Drew instead of Jimmy. Few in the league want a contract that big for a player that mediocre. It’d be an awfully big gamble but would let Minnesota clear the books to chase Butler and a free agent. Truthfully, I’d rather have Cedi than Wiggy.
Scenario 5, “Damnit, Leeroy!”
Want to take every bad contract from the Hornets to grab Kemba Walker? Here’s your chance. This trade is one of those rare awful deals for both teams, though it does clear the books for Jordan next summer. In this scenario, the Cavs would have to commit to playing at a breakneck speed all the time, because it’s the only way you’ll survive with a backcourt of Kemba and Collin, and Kidd-Gilchrist and Biyambo or TT on the floor for for stretches of the game. IDK, as much as I hate Clarkson, you might have to swap TT into that deal for him just to balance out the shooting. Still, Batum can guard, Biyambo and Kidd-Gilchrist are smart defenders, and Corey Hughey would have his dream MKG/Young Bull pairing. Love in the high post constantly scanning for MKG, Biz, and Nic on the cut? It’s not the worst offense ever envisioned, but Kev would see a LOT of double teams, and I’m not sure the Cavs would win many more games. This trade would probably get your World of Warcraft guild slaughtered.
Scenario 6. Champagne Superdova
If there’s one trade that could make the Cavs an instant contender, it’s this one. Cleveland returns a guy who took them to two straight finals, and the Bucks get a shooter and save almost $7 million off next year’s payroll. Zeller and Brown are throwins, but I like the karma of bringing back a former Cav and Shannon Brown’s brother along with Delly.
Conclusions: Thanks for riding Dapple while I pilot the Rocinante on this one. As you can see from above, there are scenarios for short term gain that improve the Cavs around the edges, and make them a little more competitive for a couple years, but all but a couple face pretty long odds at bringing the elite talent needed to complement Kevin Love and return the Cavs to a Finals contender. Still it’s fun to envision these scenarios, and many of these teams would at least be entertaining. What say you? Once more unto the breach, dear friends?
https://twitter.com/Steve_R_Walker/status/1029053777427480576
hang this up in the “young bulls ” locker —-let him look at it everyday —-when they play the nuggets ( if I.T. IS STILL ON THE TEAM ) —-let the YOUNG BULL DEVOUR HIM UP ——–GLAD THE “DRAIN ” IS GONE ——-THE FANS / PEOLPLE “INTHE LAND ” HAVE ALOT OF PRIDE / CLASS ——SOMETHING YOU DON’T HAVE !!!!—–AM SURE THE NUGGET FANS / PLAYERS WILL GET TO KNOW YOUR “DRAINING ‘ POWERS VERY QUICKLY !!!
You tell ’em, newnomad!
I.T . —“IS A DRAIN—-ALWAYS WILL BE A DRAIN ——-IS A MIDGET —-WILL ALWAYS BE A MIDGET “—–CAN’T WAIT UNTIL THE NUGGETS PLAY HERE AT THE ‘Q ” —–
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fkmxi-YlYhk
I’m hopeful he’ll instagram a comparison of Cleveland with Shanghai when he ends up there next year.
And the sh$t h$le of Cleveland didn’t want you IT, so what does that say about you?#BrinksTruck #midgetsbelonginthecircus
Well he is a sob. I tried to moderate my dislike of him since he was dealing with injury, but yeah the guy sucks. Going to miss out on his payday and will likely be out of the league by midseason.
Poor choice of words in the above clip, and a fail in his follow up “apology” on Twitter. Not impressed.
And his play on the court is even less impressive.
have to have a draft pick added to the whiteside deal ——head case plus huge contract —yes “IF ” HIS HEAD IS ON RIGHT —-then he could help—but you need that draft pick as insurance if “he/ whiteside ‘ flames out
Cavs reportedly looking to deal TT and Kyle Korver for Hassan Whiteside? Ugh…Andrew Bynum all over again
Waste of Korver. They can do better than whiteside. Wait long enough and they might get a first round pick for Korver from some desperate contender that needs shooting, a la LA.
Whiteside is no asset. If the Cavs do this trade I’m back to zero confidence in the FO again. If they Heat want to ditch him and his $27 mill, they need to throw in something good. At least TT and Korver can play.
I’d be fine with that if they got a draft pick or a good young player out of it.
Source? Amico refuted this report.
I like the Delly option but would ask for DJ Wilson in place of Zeller for taking on that contract next year. He is the perfect 2nd/3rd PG for a team that may trade G. Hill contract at the trade deadline take pressure off Sexton while also playing along side him as well.
amico hoops ‘taking a shot ‘ at national tv for the “limited ‘ number of cavs games being televised – for me ” GIVE ME FRED / A.C / ALLIE anyday over those other clowns —-go cavs !!
LOL…. I guess a lot people are asking.
I did LOL.
https://twitter.com/Reflog_18/status/1027880062060847104
Tyrod should start for at least half the season. Dude was tremendous last night. No reason to throw Baker straight into the fire when you have Taylor there.
Might even be the best strategy to ride Tyrod the whole season and flip him for a pick because I think he’ll actually play average to above-average. Crazy to think that the Browns have gone from the the worst QB situation in the NFL to potentially the 2nd best in the AFC North!
I don’t disagree. I just don’t think it will happen. Have a feeling Browns will attempt to insert Mayfield at some point this season, unless they are in playoff contention/rolling with Tyrod, at which point it would be crazy to make a change.
Aaron Rogers sat for years, and he is, when healthy, the second best or best qb in the NFL. Of course he certainly should have taken Farve’s job before Farve retired, but so it is.
I tend to agree… which is a shame because I think having Taylor means the Browns are in a position to be patient.
Steve Young sat behind Montana. Palmer behind Kitna for a year.
yup…. Carson benefitted a lot from sitting a year…. became a much more accurate passer IMO because of it.
I think Tyrod is only signed for one year. When is the NFL trading deadline?
Ah…. guess that won’t work then.
Can we get back to the 2016 uniforms please?!
and…
Baker Mayfield!!!
Taylor is a non-guaranteed contract. Looks like he comes to camp. 25% from deeap and 70% from the line are not good from a PG.
3.1 ast to 1.3 TOs is pretty darn good, however. Especially for a young PG.
You mean 35% from 3 and not 25% correct?
Although 35% isn’t great, that’s a workable, if not fixable, rate as oppose to 25% when you have guys like Korver and even JR on your team.
Seems like a nice pickup. I’ll take him at PG over Clarkson.
He shot 25% from deep. The AmicoHoops report is incorrect.
Oh :(
In non-related news, Mayfield may be the real deal. Made some beautiful NFL caliber laserbeam throws into tight windows after quickly going through his progressions. Has the head and the arm. And the throws weren’t risky. They were the right reads. The height thing may be overblown. Impressive.
Like what I saw.
Told y’all…. Mayfield best QB in the draft… showed exactly what he showed in Oklahoma. Accuracy, arm strength, decision making, “it” factor. Really wanted the Bengals to draft him if he fell…. Browns didn’t screw it up for once.
Like what I have seen so far. I am not to proud to admit I may have been wrong. Hopefully he keeps it up. I might actually start watching that team again. Callaway looks great too. Hopefully he can stay on the field/in the league. Going to have to mature quickly though.
Biggest mistake the Bengals made was not pulling the plug on Marvin Lewis and Andy Dalton. My hot take is that Mayfield will win a playoff game before the Bengals do.
Yup.. if Callaway can stop smoking weed until it’s fully legal and sanctioned, then he can be great.
Were there a lot of folks who didn’t like the pick? I don’t remember seeing a lot of backlash.
I was sort of lukewarm initially but warmed up the more I saw of him. I still think Rosen may end up being the best pure pocket passer, but he is probably not a fit on the browns right now if our line struggles. The guy is not mobile like mayfiped and given his concussion history would probably not be in a good situation here off the bat.
Rosen is definitely the best pure talent…. but I think there are legitimate questions about his mentality and he’s also too much of a risk taker on the field.
Definitely a majority…. most said he was Johnny Manziel 2.0.
I never thought he was Manziel bad. Way way way more talented in the mental game, arm strength, and accuracy from the get go. I was just hesitant based off the height when Rosen and Darnold were available. To be clear, I didn’t hate the pick, just wasn’t sure it was the best pick. He looked great last night though. Having Gorman and Callway available will help him a ton as if they can both stay on the field, they are likely the best receiving core in the league with Njoku and Landry. That certainly would ease his transition if… Read more »
Gordon
I actually agree with you re: Manziel…. I think the Manziel comparison had more to do with offensive system, height, immaturity, rather than actual talent. I think the biggest difference at the end of the day has been Mayfield’s ability to actually operate in the pocket and throw accurately from there, whereas Manziel really never showed that ability.
Cavs pick up Isiah Taylor. I posted a link that is waiting for moderation.
Is anyone else worried by the fact the Nwaba deal is not done yet? Or did I miss it?
It’s odd. Makes me think he’s using the Cavs to get a bigger contract else where.
This is complete speculation on my part, but I think it’s possible that the unspoken goal of staying under the tax to get out of the repeater penalty ASAP could be part of the hold up. This would tie Nwaba’s signing somewhat to what Hood eventually agrees to. I don’t know off the top of my head exactly how much room under the tax we still have, but let’s say we have 15 million give or take; perhaps Nwaba agreed to take a portion of the MLE that still leaves us below the tax after Hood signs with his bird… Read more »
If the Cavs can get Butler…maybe Kyrie will come back!? Haha….they are “best friends.”
Yeah. Is there a connection besides team USA that I’m unaware of?
It’s just reported on multiple podcasts by Lowe/Russillo/Simmons that they are really good friends. Kyrie was on the BS Report last month promoting his uncle drew movie and talked about his friendship with Jimmy. Durant also made mention of the kyrie/butler friendship multiple times during his 5 different pods with Simmons last year. Lowe has talked about how 2 of those 3 guys will probably end up playing together somewhere next season. I believe the writing is on the wall that Kyrie is going to leave boston, I wouldn’t be surprised if he gets moved at the deadline.
Ah ok. That is interesting info.
Pulling some pretty high G’s with some of these scenarios, Nate. I love it.
I would like to believe though that a player of Butler’s ilk would be interested in coming to the Cavs. Main sticking point for mine is that he’s gotta be thinking about getting a chip before his days are through.
Saw a rumor of Cavs discussing TT and Korver for Whiteside…no idea if it has any legs. No way I’d take Whiteside and no sweetener, he’s one of my least favorite players in the league, and a forever head case.
Yeah hard pass.
Not without a sweetener, no. Wouldn’t mind dumping TT on the Heat but that Whiteside contract… Man, it’s bad.
Whiteside is terrible.
If you took James Johnson and Dion out of the heat deal, I’d do it for Winslow.
We’d need another guard somehow. But ya, I’d probably do it too.
Did the Cavs lose Potapenko this summer? I can’t remember. He did a nice job with Zizic last season.
They did.
Well, shoot, was hoping in this scenario he’d be around to help Whiteside develop… Good thing this is in our Cavs fever dreams.
Not sold on winslow yet.
You have to take a chance to get talent.
Aside from the CJ deal, all those trades are awful. But that was the point, yes?
We should not be taking on long term salary (2+ years) unless we get a real star or a seriously high pick (top 5).
All of our bad contacts virtually drop off after next year except for TT. I have hope for Clarkson but someone has to teach him how to actually play with others instead of being in Jamal Crawford/Vinnie Johnson mode all the time.
Really? I’d give an arm for butler.
A guy who is 30 with a lot of Thibs history, and a big heart is not a good combo. I worry he breaks down (Noah, Deng).
Still, you make a fair point. That trade is not awful.
Noah and Dieng were never top 7 nba players.
Butler is not a top 7 NBA player.
I agree, plus getting butler means that there is a SMALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL chance that means Kyrie could come back. Let’s keep in mind that Kyrie left because of Lebron and Lue…not “Cleveland”. Although I believe that Kyrie + Butler or KD or even all 3 to NYK might be a done deal already.
How can dumping JR to bring back Delly NOT be a net positive? C’mahn.
This is catnip.
Froggy Fresh did predict LeBron would leave Cleveland again, although I don’t think he anticipated a ‘ship first.
Definitely bring home Dellavedova.
Yeah, I take back the part about forget every other trade besides CJ. That delly trade is nice if you only give up JR’s expiring.
Yes yes. And obviously ship Lue out, since he refused to play Delly during the Delly 1.0 era.
I think you do the CJ trade and forget every other one. Hard to find a second star, and I agree he is it. Especially considering his playoff performance against NO. Granted I get that they may have been focusing a lot on Lillard and maybe selling out on CJ in one on one, but he was dynamic in ISO situations against single coverage. No matter what kind of coverage NO was using, 25ppg on 52% shooting, 42% from three on 6+ 3pa a game, and 61% TS is impressive. He only had one game where he shot les than… Read more »
Dapple was Sancho Paza’s donkey.
Ok Quixote reference. Been about 20 years since I read that. Rocinante and Dapple. Makes sense