Recap: Cavs 144, Raptors 99 (or, Avalanche on the Hybrid League)
2021-12-27Welcome to the Hybrid League! It’s that time of year coinciding with the flu season where the National Basketball Association opens up the floodgates for G League players and would-be retirees to showcase their talents alongside multimillionaires, future Hall of Famers, and other Association survivors of the 2019-2021 carnage. Let’s not dwell on the somewhat dismal intersection of a public health emergency crashing in to the highly entertaining operations of our favorite league, a collision which has set off a scramble perhaps comparable in scale to the years 1975-1976 ABA-NBA merger, where whole teams simply evaporated and questions were asked about entertainment models and profit under a larger sense of American decline and foreign policy impotence. Nor should we be thrown back into the depressing days of Bubble Ball, where the league decamps to a remote location like Valley Forge to wait out the winter and discuss the future of Russell Westbrook. No! There is a silver lining to the massive number of players out in health and safety protocols — not least that the Cleveland Cavaliers are still playing basketball, in downtown Cleveland, and are able to continue their march into the upper brackets of the Eastern Conference.
The Toronto Raptors brought extra jerseys and their coaching staff to Cleveland, fielding a team that consisted of most of their regular second unit and some intriguing G-League players. It was a fun game worth watching and discussing. While the Raptors were able to momentarily startle the Cavs with speed, steals, and transition buckets in the first quarter, the Cavs shook off their Christmas fog and proceeded to dismantle the visitors with an impressive display of team basketball. The Cavs’ third quarter was an avalanche of makes, opening up a huge margin and ending the competition early. The last 15 minutes was essential Hybrid League (think summer league meets interim mid-season marketing experiment) — fodder for General Managers, league scouts, and diligent journalist types.
Quick Takeaways
Kevin Love continued his outstanding run in this game, scoring 22 points in 18 minutes as a starter at center; his focus, buy-in, and offensive efficiency remains a critical element in Cleveland’s success. Darius Garland overcame a slow start and picked apart the Raptors zone, matching Love with 22 points. Justin Anderson played 30 minutes and looks like a solid (perhaps Dahntay Jones-esque?) fit for the Cavs. Denzel Valentine was the cherry on top by going 5-9 from deep, and all of the Cavs starters finished in double figures. Isaac Okoro is out of protocols, sat on the bench, and should be back in the lineup shortly.
KLOV3 😍
22 PTS
6-9 3PT
7 REB@kevinlove | #LetEmKnow pic.twitter.com/13AVwNJYT7— Cleveland Cavaliers (@cavs) December 27, 2021
First Quarter
The Cavs came out with a Love-Wade-Markkanen front court, Darius Garland at shooting guard, and Rubio at point. Garland’s ability to move without the ball give the Cavs another wrinkle on offense that J.B. is sure to pull out of a hat throughout the season. Cleveland went on a 7-0 run, but the Raptors started to regularly dislodge turnovers in the paint, and the momentum turned, due primarily to D.J. Wilson, who had four steals in the quarter. Wilson was the sole G-Leaguer in Toronto’s starting lineup; he was a Michigan Wolverine/John Beilein student from 2014-2017, played for the Bucks for a few years and ended up in Houston (and then OKC’s G-League team) as part of the P.J. Tucker trade in March 2021. Although he was often confused about defensive assignments, he had a good showing.
Chris Boucher, the lanky Montreal-Nord center, dragged down Toronto’s shooting percentage but got to the line repeatedly and was responsible for the lion’s share of the Raptors’ early rebound advantage over Cleveland. The Raptors were everywhere on the glass, pulling down 7 offensive rebounds to Cleveland’s 0, and outrebounding the Cavs 18-9 in the quarter. Yuta Watanabe was doing his best Cedi Osman impersonation, gliding up for speedy twos and also rebounding well, pulling down 13 boards to go with his 26 points (on 11-20 shooting) on the night .
Nick Nurse called the first timeout to get fresh bodies on the floor, but it might as well have been J.B. The notion put forward by Austin Carr that the Cavs hadn’t prepared to play this team or had no opportunity to scout them was a bit of a red herring — the Toronto starters were more or less their second unit, players the Cavs had gone up against last year.
Nurse then unveiled all of his meager cards, playing the small but crafty point guard Tremont Waters and his two former Big-10 big men (about whom more later). The Cavs were slightly disorganized whereas disorganization was working in the favor of the Raptors, who were running, scrambling, no hierarchy in place on offense, running very few half court sets. The Cavs stayed in the game via steady play from Kevin Love, who at one point was on the floor with four reserves (Pangos, Valentine, Anderson, and Kornet).
J.B. had a word with Darius after he unsuccessfully gambled for a steal at the end of the overly-wild first quarter. Speaking to his star guard with the assurance of a man who has been given a contract and thus a vision into the sunlit (post-pandemic?) uplands of 2027, J.B. probably just told him to slow down and collect himself.
Leadership. #LetEmKnow pic.twitter.com/SFpCAuJFcC
— Cleveland Cavaliers (@cavs) December 27, 2021
Second Quarter
With the Cavs needing separation from this pesky Toronto team, Lauri Markkanen stepped up with several dominant minutes. The big Finn buried three dunks, establishing himself via bully ball on the frustrated Svi Mykhailiuk, and hitting a baseline mid-ranger off of a no-look pass from the telepathic Denzel Valentine.
Justin Anderson showed nice touch passes, playing with confidence and poise. As if to both emphasize his comfort with the team but also take advantage of the time on stage, at one point as Toronto was calling time out after Dean Wade crashed from the weak side to dunk the ball home, Anderson curled out to high-five courtside fans.
The Cavs were very much winning the battle of attrition as Mykhailiuk picked up his third foul and the Raptors defense started to evaporate. Kevin Pangos came in and made matters worse for the Canadian team, perceptively bypassing Kevin Love and feeding an open Kornet under the rim. Kornet notched the only Cavs block of the evening, doing a credible momentary impression of Cleveland’s “Tower City.” Pangos did exemplary work on his perimeter defensive rotations and held his assignment Tremont Waters to 0-3 in the quarter.
Given a boost by a Denzel steal and dunk in the open court, J.B.’s squad went into the break up 17, reflecting the truth of the C:tB live thread observation by West Coast Cav: “Cavs starting to look like the Cavs.”
DENZEL VALENTINE.@denzelvalentine | #LetEmKnow pic.twitter.com/es5sG22F2q
— Cleveland Cavaliers (@cavs) December 27, 2021
Dean Wade, “looking like he just came out of the dryer” (h/t BW on the livethread) gave an interview about his weak side dunk and game prep.
Third Quarter
Kevin Love clearly decided to control the game as the Cavs came out for the second half. He immediately widened the wedge of victory with a soft two, a three-pointer, and five rebounds. In that easiest of visual barometers for player motivation, Love also had consistent and effective closeouts on Boucher. (Boucher, perhaps recalling advice he had received years ago at the University of Oregon, finally tried a pump fake and drive about halfway through the quarter.) Love sat down for the evening halfway through the frame, with the game well in the bag.
Darius (an obscene plus 24 in the quarter) went calmly ballistic and dropped in three triples, starting his barrage from the halfcourt logo. The Cavs went 9-16 from distance in the quarter. They also outrebounded Toronto 15-7, in part due to J.B. inserting Tacko Fall with 3:20 left in the quarter. Fall gathered three boards on a single possession, sending the crowd into ecstasy.
Fourth Quarter
Denzel Valentine looked like a better version of Jordan Clarkson out there, canning two of his three triples, making good decisions and ripping down four rebounds. R.J. Nembhard played all twelve minutes, dishing out half a dozen assists and trying to feed former Cincinnati Bearcat Trevon Scott for his first NBA points. Scott ended up going 3-6, playing most of the period, showing nice offensive finishing with the left hand and picking off a steal. Luke Kornet was less impressive, turning down the opportunity to show off his range from three. Pangos and Anderson looked like professionals and the Cavs put this game away easily, not even suffering a gouge on their plus/minus numbers.
Randoms
-Kevin Love exited halfway through the third quarter, just one rebound short of a double-double, but in his Christmas generosity it seems unlikely he begrudged that board to a teammate. Love is currently 19th all-time NBA in career double doubles, having pulled even with Chris Webber (445). Among active players, Love is trailing the surprisingly durable Chris Paul (485) and three members of the Los Angeles Lakers, namely his old UCLA running mate Russell Westbrook (465), Cuyahoga Leviathan LeBron James (515), and reptile enthusiast Dwight Howard (744).
-J.B. and the coaching staff appear determined to keep working on Tacko Fall, giving him 11 minutes of time in this game and freedom to try some inside offensive moves. He remains ponderous and turnover-prone but as J.B. showed against Boston there are merits to his play in certain matchups.
-The Raptors bench for this game included two big men of the Big 10, namely Juwan Morgan from Indiana University-Bloomington and Daniel Oturu from the University of Minnesota. Oturu went to high school in Woodbury, Minnesota, so was a local recruit for J.B. Bickerstaff’s own Golden Gophers (J.B. was a point guard in Williams Arena, a local shrine of sorts, in the 1990s). He was drafted by the Timberwolves and ended up as a third-string center for the LA Clippers last year, getting sporadic regular-season minutes alongside a quad injury and tasting four garbage-time playoff minutes against the Phoenix Suns before being traded to the Grizzlies, cut again, and then getting preseason run with the Chicago Bulls. He is more of defensive specialist than an offensive creator, but has raw potential. Like Isaac Okoro, his parents are Nigerian immigrants to the US.
-The Raptors desperately needed bodies and playmaking in this game, and have needed it since mid-December. Yet the healthy and signed veteran guard Goran Dragic, hasn’t played for the team since November 13. A CBC article provides a useful breakdown on his role and a few minor insights into the impasse; he is and has been away from the team for more than a month for “personal reasons.” He is 35 years old and on the final year of a deal paying him a Rubio-esque $19 million per year before he hits free agency next year. Keep an eye on Dragic as a trade piece.
-Speaking of trade talk: Watching the Cavs last game against Toronto was, in a sense, poor preparation for this very unique Hybrid Season (TM) game. Not only was that game extremely close down the stretch — featuring a fantastic Jarrett Allen bailout three and clutch free throws from Garland to win the game — it included a prominent role for Cavs shooting guard Collin Sexton, aka “Young Bull.” C:tB’s Chris Francis astutely pointed out in his recap of that game that J.B. made the perilous decision to go with Sexton rather than Rubio for significant stretches in the fourth quarter, and it nearly lost Cleveland the game. Watching it for the third or fourth time, it appears that Sexton’s crunch time decision making was suspect, his ballhandling error-prone, and his inability to accept the fact that he was sitting as the minutes ticked down and the game tightened (coaching staff literally had to push him down the bench away from J.B.) was more than a little bit uncomfortable. Every time Ben Simmons is mentioned with respect to the Cavs, I personally feel a little dumber, but the Sexton Wars seem ready to return to a state of flare up after a Christmas Truce, and returning to Cavs-Raptors games gone by seem as insignificant yet useful a matchstick as any upon which to reignite the debate.
Final Thoughts
In the end, this was an avalanche of Cavs professionalism and cultural continuity overcoming the jangling yet potentially dangerous Raptors. The Cavs and the Raptors will meet again on the other side of the All Star Break, twice in that decisive month of March. Call it irrational exuberance in the avalanche aftermath, but two more wins against the Raptors this year and Cleveland will be able to sweep the season series with Toronto for the first time since 2008-2009.
live thread up
Boom shakalakkah, go Cavs!!!!
Adam great recap, love the historical perspective on KLove, Hall of Fame player!!!!
Thank you Chris, we are watching greatness this year! I hope the TV play by play guys can work in the double double surpassing of CWebb when it happens, if ESPN can turn LBJ Xmas trivia into click bait surely KLove deserves more merit for his HOF worthy achievements as he reaches his third prime
PREACH IT ADAM!
POSSIBLY SEE MOBES TONIGHT —PROBABLY IN LIMITED MINUTES —-THE ‘HYBRID ‘ SEASON CONTINUES—IN FULL FORCE
Fedor has a tweet saying the plan is for him to play some, but they want to run him through some stuff before the game to make sure his conditioning is OK. He was asymptomatic.
Still, Jonas is gonna be a load for him or Live to handle. He might need Tackoed.
Well, crap! If I am counting right, Rubio, Wade, Pangos, Fall, & Sexton are the only guys not to catch COVID.
Garland, Okoro, Markannen, Mobley, Allen, Osman, Love, Stevens, Windler, Davis, Valentine, & Nembhard all have.
If Ice is still out:
Rubio, Valentine, Markannen, Wade, Love.
Pangos, Nembhard, Anderson, Scott, Kornet/Fall.
https://twitter.com/kelseyyrusso/status/1475889399812481030?s=21
Blahhh
YOU KNEW IT WAS JUST A MATTER OF TIME—D.G. ENTERING SAFETY PROTOCOL—-WE MIGHT AS WELL GET USED TO IT —–HOPING VALENTINE/ PANGOS CAN CONTINUE THEIR GOOD PLAY
Plus one on that NOMAD
JUST FOLLOWING UP ON THE “LEBRON RETURN ” TO CLEVELAND—-I SAY NO FOR ALOT OF DIFFERENT REASONS—DO NOT TRADE ANY OF OUR YOUNG TALENTED PLAYERS —-DO NOT WANT THE DRAMA THAT FOLLOWS HIM—-WOULD BREAK UP THE CHEMISTRY—–MORE IMPORTANTLY IF LEBRON WOULD COME BACK AND CAVS GO DEEP INTO THE PLAYOFFS OR EVEN WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP -ALL THE CREDIT WOULD GO TO LEBRON—NO I WANT TO WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP WITH THIS YOUNG CORE OF PLAYERS —WILL MEAN SOOOO M UCH MORE !!!!
Not trading for him. If he wants to come back after his Laker deal runs out, then super.
In other news, Mobley clears protocols. Might be a bit before he plays again.
https://twitter.com/ShamsCharania/status/1475877627818876929?s=20
Allen, Stevens, Windler, Davis, & Cedi still remain in. JA, Stevens, and Dylan entered protocols the day after Evan, so hopefully they are close. We have a b2b coming up after the Pels game (Wash & ATL).
Obviously ain’t trading for him.
Agree with NOMAD that even signing him for the minimum might be a mistake.
Windy with a Cavs piece for four letter:
https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/32947881/the-cleveland-cavaliers-were-mocked-bucking-nba-small-ball-trend-now-contending-home-court
Damn an actual long read, looks like a keeper – – Windy’s recent podcast got into some of the back story on the Toronto game, apparently he was texting w Nick Nurse, well sourced anyway
I didn’t get past the paywall. Any key points to relate?
Interviews with JB and Koby Altman, some interesting details on Love (he agreed to come off bench but wanted to earn minutes and not get John Wall Rockets treatment, OK) and Markkanen (not an immediate decision to start him). Also some details on a September coaching retreat where they hashed out roster and strategy. No Rubio or Sexton talk in the sections I have so far read, focus is on the bigs
Does anyone know what happened to Dylan Windler after he fell on his head (and then got covid)?!? I can’t seem to find any non-covid injury update for this guy.
That was one of the few games I got to watch in full — bartender at the local Bengal’s fan bar (much bigger crowd lately) did a heroic job of finding it for me.
How come there was no foul called on that play? It was obviously unintentional, but yikes!
This is the most exciting Cavs TEAM of my lifetime, only rivaled by Price, Daugherty, Williams, Nance and Harper. Like that team, it could be anyone’s night for this team. Rubio is a godsend, Allen a revelation, Love a pleasant surprise, and Garland a future MVP, and the player with the brightest future, Mobley, is only 20. Every other player has met or exceeded expectations. And we locked up a GREAT coach! Koby Altman became the city’s sharpest GM while we weren’t paying attention. GO CAVS!!’
agree with Mike!
New COVID rules in effect. Vaccinated/boosted players can now come back in 6 days if their test levels shoe they are not a transmission risk (35 cycles ir more for a positive test).
I think all our positives save Cedi & Davis are outside 6 days. So maybe we get guys back.
Awesome recap Adam! It’s amazing that “playing like a Cavs team” is a thing for the first time that meant “LeBron iso”
Thank you Chris – I was watching some 2016 Finals today with a young family member. So. Much. Iso!
Cavs in top 20: Allen: Per game: Rebounds (9th), Blocks (16th) Totals: Reb (12th), ORebs (T 8th), Def Rebs (15th); —–Blocks (17th), 2PT FGs (14th), Shooting: FG% (2nd), 2PT% (2nd), EFG% (2nd), —– TrSh% (2nd). Adv: PER (11th), Win Shares (4th), OWS (8th), DWS (4th), WS/48 (5th), BPM (12th), DBPM (12th), VORP (11th), ORtg (4th), DRtg (3rd), Reb% (16th), OReb% (11th), DReb% (18th), Garland: Per game: Assists (10th), Totals: Assists (8th), Minutes (T-13th), TOs (4th) Shooting: FT% (5th), Adv: DWS (18th), Assist% (11th) Rubio: Per game: Assists (14th), Steals (19th) Totals: Assists (10th), Steals (13th), TOs (T-19th) Adv: DWS (9th),… Read more »
If you click the read more link, my last post becomes readable. And more importantly, the fact that Jarrett Allen should be an all-star becomes obvious.
All stats frim bbref after the Toronto game.
Allen & Mobley are also elite in the shits contested metric from cleaning the glass.
Love the “Shits Contested Metric”! I saw ’em open for the “Butt Run Rascals” at Buddakan.
Oops. My fat fingers on my phone.
haha – I try not to use my phone for anything but calls and mini texts.
LET’S BE REALISTIC—IF LEBRON REALLY WANTED TO COME BACK TO THE CAVS —HE WOULD ” WAVE –THROW HIS LEBRON MAGIC DUST ” AND MAKE IT HAPPEN—HOW MANY MORE YEARS DOES HE HAVE ON HIS CURRENT LAKER CONTRACT—JUST LET HIM SIGN AS A FREE AGENT TO COME BACK HERE—DO NOT TRADE ANY OF OUR YOUNG TALENT
We don’t need him
agree.. just allow the tall timber to continue to grow.. the force is strong with this group.. let it be.. jpg&r..
At this point, he would probably be more trouble than he is worth.
Happy holidays Cavs fans!! Is it too early to talk about dubs-cavs 5th final?
Curious question one of my friend was wondering, would Cavs take back Lebron in a trade if he wants to come back and finish career as a Cav while going for another ring?
For Love & Sexton?
You can get Westbrook for those two :-). I am not sure, but seems like you have to include Jarrett Allen and do a 3 way trade. I think the trade will only happen if Cavs desire to get Lebron is stronger.
are you out of your mind? Jarrett Allen is worth way more than LeBron at this point.
I am unsure if LBJ plus rest of the core is enough to ensure a finals berth against a healthy bucks or nets, which is the only way I would do it. At this point the cavs have a very good and very young core signed and/or on rookie contracts.
But are the Cavs better with, say, LeBron in place of Love and Allen? I doubt it, and LeBron has maybe one more year where he is as good as Allen.
It is conceivable that LeBron will play out his contract in LA (or get out of it) and come to Cleveland and play for small $$ to chase a ring. He would still be a great sixth man to come off the bench for spurts. Maybe he could go for five, ten minutes without taking a few plays off for “chilling” and/or rest.
Seems like an LA thing to trade for Love&Sex!
Interesting question. The best case scenario would be if he came as a free agent, after his contract is over (2023?). He would hopefully come to a much more experienced and accomplished team and the Cavs wouldn’t have to part with any players of significance to get him.
Realistically, Lebron gets what Lebron wants. No team would be foolish enough to pass on him, considering he would raise the value of the franchise by an absurd amount.
I can’t fathom though Lebron being involved in a trade. He has never done it and I don’t believe he would start now.
What Nomad said above makes sense but I think the owner would just go for it even if you have to lose Jarrett Allen in the process and hope Lebron can convince some cheap signings.
I dont think i am in the minority in not missing lebron’s off court drama in the slightest. Lebron’s on court prowess is not getting better at this point. He is still a top player but he stops the ball like crazy unless he is within an organization he respects. He has proven he doesnt respect the cavs org multiple times. I want no part of that lebron. Zero interest in trading for him. Barely any interest in his on court talents as a free agent. And very concerned he doesn’t actually ever help develop young talent he plays with…he… Read more »
right. and he hates playing with young guys. that will be a problem for him now that he is approaching “older than dirt” age.
Also short term lebron is not near good enough or likeable enough as a recruiter at this point to be worth Allen. Will not happen.
Alfonzo McKinnie has signed a standard contract with the Bulls. He had been tearing up the G-league and his 3PT & FT shooting had both improved a ton. I wanted us to take a flier on him.
Anderson is more athletic and bouncy. But for some reason I think McKinnie’s shooting improvement is real. IDK if he stays over 40%, though.
JUST CHECKED OUT JUSTIN ANDERSONS PRE DRAFT PROFILE——VERY ATHLETIC—43″ VERTICLE—GREAT LENGTH—-AN NBA READY BODY—–CAN DEFEND ANY 3 POSITIONS —–GOOD SPOT UP SHOOTER—–VERY GOOD FINISHER// GREAT IN TRANSITION—-GOOD–WILLING PASSER—–GOOD LEADER——SOUNDS LIKE THE TYPE OF PLAYER THAT THE CAVS WANT// CAN FIT IN
After New Year’s has the roughest patch of remaining schedule, in my view. Sandwiched around a 6 game road trip (with 2 b2bs and trips to GSW & Utah) are home games with Memphis & Brooklyn and topped off with a trip to Chicago.
Mem, at Port, at GSW, at Sac (b2b), at Utah, at SA, at OKC (b2b), Brooklyn, at Chicago.
Being close-ish to healthy for that stretch would be fantastic.
Well, with Valentine, Nembhard, and now Okoro out of protocols, things are starting to look up. Especially with the good/steady play from Valentine, Pangos, & Nembhard/Anderson. I feel pretty good about our guards/wings even with Cedi, Windler, & Stevens in protocols.
Bigs is another matter with Mobley, Allen, & Davis all out. Love, Wade, Big Finnish and not much else.
The at NO game will be day 10 for Mobley. The next game at Washington will be day 11 for Allen, Stevens, and Mobley.
Fantastic recap.
I keep wondering why the Cavs have not applied for a DPE for Sexton. An extra body sure would be helpful. Anderson could be it
Does that remove the opportunity to have sexton come back for the playoffs? Not saying I want him to but could be what the cavs are holding out for?
https://twitter.com/phxIIymxkan/status/1475257799789715461?s=20
Incredible recap – thank you Adam.
Always a pleasure, Simmo! Like JB Bickerstaff, Nate Smith and his team of prose smithies demand excellence. Hope you are enjoying these unusually slow days as 2021 ticks down
BOTH CAMPY AND FRATELLO BOTH THINK THAT LAURI HAS THE TOOLS// SKILLS TO ELEVATE HIS GAME AND BECOME A ” SPECIAL ” PLAYER—BUT AGREE HE HAS TO REALIZE THE WORK// EFFORT NEEDED TO BECOME THIS TYPE OF PLAYER —-LET’S HOPE HE BUYS IN// UNDERSTANDS THIS AND DEVELOPS INTO THIS TYPE OF PLAYER
WOW WHAT A RECAP—-TRULY ENETERTAINING—-THANK YOU —-THE PICTURE OF J.B/// D.G. TELLS EVERYTHING ABOUT THEIR SPECIAL RELATIONSHIP// BONDING WHICH HOPEFULLY ONLY GROWS–MATURES GOING FORWARD ——-TACKO IS A ” REB// MIN ” —-A FAN FAVORITE AND YES LET’S KEEP WORKING WITH THIS GUY–WHO KNOWS —–HAVE POSTED EARLIER—WAS A FAN OF JUSTIN ANDERSON WHEN HE CAME OUT OF THE DRAFT—-HE BRINGS— ” AUSTIN –CAMPY ” BOTH SAID IT —THAT ‘BULLDOG ATTITUDE ” –ATHLETICISM// EXPERIENCE THAT I THINK CAN HELP THE CAVS—JUST KNOW AND PLAY YOUR ROLE WHICH IS WHAT ALL THE CAVS PLAYERS HAVE EMBRACED AND DO SO WELL —GO CAVS !!!
Well said NOMAD, I guess with Anderson it may come down to roster spots, assuming things ever snap back to “normal”, I haven’t been counting the very end of the bench.If Okoro and Stevens are healthy maybe less urgency to bring in Anderson. Heard a good pod about the income implications for the G Leaguers, they are at least seeing a nice pay packet in the meantime.
Fantastic cap, Adam. Liked the recollection on Sexton at the end.
Thank you Nate. I finally got up to speed with the Woj flotsam so am glad to provide some more specifics about Sexton’s “fit” and track record. Watched some of his 2019 play against the Pelicans today and obviously he has made some decent strides on defense at least…