Recap: Cleveland 121, Detroit 104 (Or, Better Off Without You)
2018-01-29The Cleveland Cavaliers pulled off their second straight victory, defeating the Detroit Pistons 121 to 104. The score is a little deceiving as the scoring margin was much closer throughout most of the game. Luckily for the Cavs, Tyronn Lue made a rare good decision as he left his biggest defensive warts on the bench in the fourth quarter. It was clear the Cavs were better off without a certain diminutive guard who may or may not feel like he should shoulder any blame for the recent stretch of poor play.
The first quarter began poorly as it was evident that the Pistons were aware of the Cavaliers’ defensive struggles this season. Within the first three minutes of the game it was clear who Detroit’s random mediocre player turned one night all-star would be as Anthony Tolliver quickly contributed two straight wide open threes. The Cavaliers have yet to make a coaching or personnel change so the poor defense is clearly not going anywhere. Part of that reason is because Isaiah Thomas is still receiving significant minutes. Despite having seven assists, the ball managed to stick in his hands far too much, often halting Cleveland’s momentum throughout the first half of the quarter.
Fortunately, TLue had Thomas on a short leash. The Pistons turned the ball over at the six minute mark and Derrick Rose entered the game, replacing IT. Shortly after, JR Smith built on his success from the previous game and hit a quick triggered corner three to put the Cavs up by seven. For the remainder of the quarter, Cleveland was able to keep Detroit at arms length as Tristan Thompson was refreshingly efficient on the offensive end. In the clip below, TT finishes a tough transition basket, picking up the foul and the extra free throw, he would finish the game with 9 points and 4 rebounds. The quarter ended 33-28 Cavs.
The second quarter saw the return of Isaiah Thomas. The momentum built from the end of the first promptly stalled. Thomas had trouble running the offense and managed to put up 12 shots in only 27 minutes over the course of the game, he keeps chucking away. Cleveland ran iso-heavy sets for the scoring guard, but he was unable to score. What was a spectacular finish or a drawn foul last season is a blocked shot or a no-call as Thomas can’t quite replicate last season’s success. And since he provides nothing on the defensive end of the floor, the game was quickly tied at 35 and three minutes into the quarter, the Pistons retook the lead.
Anthony Tolliver continued to embarrass the Cavs, hitting his fourth three of the game by midway through the second quarter. Cleveland’s propensity to turn novice players into all-stars is, if nothing else, consistent. If not for the stellar play of Kevin Love (20 points, 11 rebounds), who had 14 first half points, this quarter would have seen a more size-able deficit by half time. With IT playing the entire quarter, Cleveland’s five point lead turned into being down by three at the half. 61-58 Detroit.
The third quarter was more of the same as the starters re-entered the game. The slight difference was that a few of Isaiah’s shots began to fall. There was just nothing he could do with someone like Andre Drummond on the court. At one point, the large center simply caught a pass above IT’s head and made a layup without even a bother from the 5’9″ body directly underneath him. Thomas spent most of the time getting caught underneath the hoop where there is relatively no chance of him helping the defense.
The best plays to happen during the quarter came from the bench rather than any of the starters. Korver, Frye, and Jeff Green showed why they are key parts of one of the most productive benches in the league. Channing Frye flexed his versatility as a head fake gave him enough room to drive around his defender and kick it to his fellow three point specialist to the Korner for a wide open threy. Why Frye was ever benched, I’ll never know. Unsurprisingly, Jeff Green put the finishing touches on the quarter with a monster jam in transition, see below. Cavs 90, Pistons 87.
After three straight quarters of the Cleveland Standard Defense, Lue seemed to realize that the Cavs were better off without IT, at least this game. He did not start the quarter, nor would he play for the remainder of the game. The result was predictable. Cleveland saw a noticeable uptick as competent defense was finally being played. The lineup of LeBron, Korver, Green, Crowder, and Frye was able to stretch the lead back out to seven. To be fair, this five man group struggled mightily to keep Detroit’s (backup) quicker and smaller guards out of the paint. Dwight Buycks was able to stroll right in for multiple easy lay ups and that’s inexcusable. Fortunately, the lineup’s size was able to prevent too much damage and was even better on offense. They were also able to do things like this:
At four minutes to go in the game, starters Kevin Love and JR Smith (15 points, 4-7 from 3) returned to the game to finish things out. JR promptly made a couple of three pointers while Korver mixed it up with a tough baseline drive around his defender and the Cavs were suddenly up by 11. The game never got any closer and the lead ballooned out to a 121-104 Cavaliers victory.
Some Notes:
1) Channing Frye has been nothing but a true professional for this team. After being inexplicably relegated back to the bench upon Tristan’s return, Frye said and did all the right things. He stayed ready and is finally getting minutes again. The Cavs have been more successful in the two games since his return. He finished the night with 7 points, 7 rebounds, 2 assists, and a steal. Seriously, how could you not play this guy?
2) The Detroit Pistons were without both of their starting guards as Reggie Jackson and Avery Bradley were out tonight. Cleveland point guards could still not keep up. It’s a problem. It reminds me of how the Cavs were playing right before Griffin traded two first round picks for Timofey Mozgov. Since the front office isn’t going to move IT, hopefully they are looking for a mobile and offensively capable rim protector.
3) The past two games have seen the return of JR Smith. His shot was noticeably more confident. He was catching and shooting in one smooth motion. He’s been second guessing his shot all season long so it’s nice to see the change. Hopefully this version of the Pipe Fitter is here to stay.
4) Iman Shumpert logged a DNP-CD today. I’m not sure if they are holding him out because Lue truly feels he should be out of the rotation or if he actually is part of a trade. I am a little surprised they didn’t try to go to him for a couple minutes in the third with how bad the guard play was between DRose and IT. Ty Lue seemed to favor Shump in the past, if this continues, it will mark a change in attitude toward the disappointing defensive stopper.
Most of the game was back and forth until the second half of the fourth quarter but Cleveland was able to hang on for just their third win in nine games. Every game will likely resemble this one until the Cavs can play even mediocre defense. Cleveland faces off against Detroit again on Tuesday hoping for the same results. Go Cavs!
https://twitter.com/BenAxelrod/status/958372963459485697
Who woulda thunk it?
Team LeBron dropping like flies… first Boogie, now Wall…
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/22263710/washington-wizards-star-john-wall-undergo-knee-procedure
Maybe IT can replace him /s
I know you are joking. It should be Dragic.
That’s why I added the “/s”
https://twitter.com/mcten/status/958370653312253952
https://twitter.com/damanr/status/958124288657076224
I miss those commercials…
In a way this does make Griffin a “pioneer”
https://twitter.com/Rachel__Nichols/status/958128544563056640
Send IT to the Clippers for Bradley and attach the CAVS pick to the deal.
IT and Gilbert are apparently BFF, so I don’t think IT is on the block…
https://www.fearthesword.com/2018/1/30/16950154/isaiah-thomas-dan-gilbert-favorite
Oh God I was hoping this wasn’t true. Please someone buy this team before it turns back into a dumpster fire.
What do Gilbert, Felder and IT all have in common? We’re apparently doomed to a steady stream of little people as long as Dan owns the team.
https://twitter.com/World_Wide_Wob/status/958139087864717314
This is so funny and so pathetic.
“A word on loyalty: The Clippers went out of their way to label Griffin a “Clipper for life.” As I first revealed here, the preamble to their free agency pitch meeting involved walking Griffin through a makeshift museum of his life and then retiring his number — literally raising it to the rafters as music played in an empty Staples Center — in a staged “ceremony.” (They obviously took the banner down and stored it somewhere.)” — Zach Lowe
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/22258759/zach-lowe-blake-griffin-trade-future-la-clippers-detroit-pistons
I think this move was to improve attendance for the Pistons. They are struggling to fill that new arena.
I guess Blake wishes he negotiated that no-trade clause. He’s stuck in Detroit for 5 years now.
He might get traded for Marcus Smart in a couple of years once Smart has that max contract…
I think the Pistons are going to regret taking on that contract in a couple of years.
It’s a pretty ridiculous contract.
6 months earlier:
https://twitter.com/MarcJSpearsESPN/status/881202410907029504
With Wall out for a little while… time to get crazy? http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y8bu34fg
They’ve got to hit reset sometime, don’t they? Haha
+1 RIGHT~! LOL
Going off ESPN’s standings, the Nets pick is down (up?) to 6th at the moment. They have a 3 games in four nights stretch coming up & RHJ has a groin issue. Hopefully they lose them all & fall to 18-35. Suddenly within range of a bottom 5 winning percentage of .333.
Griffin going to Pistons I think will define his career moving forward. He will no doubt be ‘the man’ in Detroit and be interesting how he pairs with Drummond and Reggie along with other scrubs. Always felt Griffin was overrated due to the overhype on him dunking over white dudes and guards early in his career and everyone thinking he was next best thing. Really haven’t seen that much of him to prove that so think in Eastern conference he at least has a shot to make a name for himself.
The next game is distracting me from the usual worrying about Cavs performance. NBA.com still lists Tobias Harris as a team leader for this matchup. Not their fault they are out of date. I assume Blake will be there, right? How does Van Gundy manage such a significant roster change like this? Will be interesting to see how Blake handles the game, his head must be spinning. I can only think this gives the Cavs a good opportunity to score another much-needed win.
Hopefully the Cavs don’t embarrass themselves going against Drummond and the Pistons B squad tonight. No Harris along with the missing back court.
Everyone has to pass their physicals with their new team before the trade becomes official. May be unlikely in time for tonight’s game, given the number of players involved and the travel — not to mention Blake’s injury history, which may take some time for doctors to work through.
I believe they’ve already said that Griffin won’t be playing tonight.
So Cavs can focus on stopping Felder. Nice.
+1 They’ll need all the help they can get!
Any chance the Knicks want Shump back? I’d take Courtney Lee and Kyle O’Quinn of their hands.
Knicks fans are chanting “BRING SHUMP HOME!!”
Pretty wild ending to the Celts / Nuggets game. Denver was about 0.2 seconds late after Kyrie’s brick.
Cavs have no shot at beating Warriors. Cavs probably will not go to finals this year. What a run it was for Lebron. Seven years, incredible.
Who in the East isbgoing to win 4 out of 7 against the Cavs? The answer is still nobody unless we are injured. The boston celtics cant beat us with Al Horford as their 2nd best player. I’m not about to agree that kyrie irving can become a good enough facilitator to get them enough points from everyone else. The raptors will put up a fight if they actually get to us, but theyre not winning 4 of 7 with derozan as their best player. The playoffs are such a different type of basketball. There are so few similarities to… Read more »
Agree with Scotch. The Raps and Celts have a shot, but it is the Cavs Conference to win. Particularly if they are playing their best players, and the guys are playing up to potential.
Then it will be a long shot against the Dubs. But, there is a reason they play the games.
On the LeBron to Clippers possibility: I’m not familiar with all the players involved, but would the Clippers have any chance of getting to the Finals in the next 3-4 years? If not, it’s hard to imagine LeBron making the move.
If he goes to LA to either teams, he pretty much has given up going into finals and started preparing for post basketball life.
I’m with warriorsfan on this one. Zero chance unless he’s thinking post NBA.
At the moment, OKC (if everyone stays), Houston and Minnesota give him the best chances to walk into a championship contender and claim it as his own team.
I think it would be hilarious if he told minny he wanted to go there and then Wiggins get traded to clear cap space…
Zero chance, imo…or as close to zero as you get in sports.
That is a true long shot. The Russians will have to rig something for that to happen.
Tomorrow:
Nets at Knicks
Magic at Rockets
Kings at Pelicans
Hawks & Grizz win. Wins:
14 = Magic
15 = Hawks, Kings
16 = Mavs
17 = Suns
18 = Nets, Bulls, Grizz
19 = Lakers
20 = Hornets
jrl was referring to the previous post of clippers to the clippers have flexibality / cap space—figured / assumed he was referencing clippers going after LeBron —reason for my post —-sorry if it was confusing
Nomad, what I meant was your tendency to respond via a completely new message as opposed to answering under the one you were reading.
It throws off the conversation ;)
???????????????
Kind of crazy trade considering Clippers owner liked Griffin, from everything I’ve heard…he bought into that franchise pretty high. I am not really a Blake Griffin fan, but it seems like a pretty good deal for the Pistons…they weren’t keeping Bradley, anyway, and the rest of that package is composed of just decent players and guys…not sure what Rivers is doing, honestly…
If Marjanovic was used properly he would out-score and out-rebound Blake on a nightly basis.
Yeah, not sure about that, but I agree he’s a good get…I forgot about him when I typed ‘decent players’…
https://twitter.com/FoxSportsRadio/status/958137529055801345
Pretty spot on
Haha Will people stop posting this crap? The cavs Will NEVER get rid of IT at this rate
He is an expiring. Next to no value as a UFA. Coming off a serious injury and with possible chemistry issues. Only way it makes sense is for: a) A contender who thinks he puts them over the top. Most of them are set at PG. So IT would be on the bench, and chemistry issues. Plus, we would get prospects back, not players from a contender. b) A team looking to shed salary & rebuild. He is inly a $6 mil+ salary, so we wouldn’t get a stud back. Channing is our other expiring & he is integral. TT… Read more »
Honestly, if we could just do IT for Lou Williams I would be ecstatic. DJ is a lateral move from TT.
Nomad, can I ask a big favor – could you respond to the comment via the reply button as opposed to a new comment?
Its difficult to follow your train of thought when the comments are not in sequence.
Pretty please ;)
Agree with JRL on that one.
I don’t think he got it ;)
Well, the all-caps were retired except in times of great stress. He might just do it, since you asked so nicely…
Phoenix visits Memphis tonight. Both have 17 wins. Someone gonna get to 18 & tie the Nets.
can’t see him going there —not enough talent to do what LeBron wants to do—contend for an nba title
Didn’t know this but the trade may have allowed the Clippers a lot of flexibility next summer as i read on espn.
1. LA
2. Beverly
3. Avery Bradley bird rights
4. Galo shooting
5. DJ gone
They might’ve positioned themselves to land Lebron.
They only land lebron if more than LeBron comes too. Who goes to flipper land with LeBron to make him want to go?
Salary Cap to sign 2. PG and Bron
Clips ain’t getting LeBron… what, did they forget they don’t have CP3 any more? LOL
gilbert isn’t letting go of that nets pick for DJ/ LOU
How about TT & IT?
My bad, pick protected 1-4 (thought it was 14).
Blake signed a 5 year extension this summer, methinks. So Detroit has him for a while.
Blake is the best player in the deal by a mile. Edge = Pistons. Though it may take a while. Jackson, Bullock,????, Blake, Drummond is pretty tough.
Blake is crazy injury prone. Tobias Harris probably has the most real potential in the trade except that he is going to play for a serial non-player development coach. This is a lateral move by the end of the year when blake has a broken arm or something
Blake can’t stay healthy and has not had a particularly good shooting year…
Well, that is a stunner. Blake & Drummond frontcourt in Detroit. Size matters. Lost two pretty good pkayers in Harris & Bradley. Picks seem to be lotto protected.
Wonder what some combination of: IT, TT, Crowder, Shump + our pick could bring?
Had there been any chatter about this happening? I suspect that most to the chatter we constantly hear is total BS.
Any early thoughts on who “won” the trade?
Griffin might be a hard guy to win with, but now he has a real coach, so who knows?
I have a massive man-crush on Marjanovic – that plus the picks and both Bradley and Harris for a good player but not one to take over a game and win it, I think the Clips won that one.
Blake is a good 2-3 option on a championship team. He’s a more athletic Love. Yes he will win you some games but you can’t build around him.
Doesn’t have the range Love does. But MUCH more athletic
Well yeah ;)
Although his desire to overuse his athleticism to hide some of his basketball deficiencies is what has caused his injuries (imo).
He’s a a Love/TT mashup with 50/50 of each as opposed to 100/100.
Yeah and once his athleticism starts to wane…
Doc learned from D-R-AINGED
Man he got Gundy good.
so does this trade start a series of big trades / yeah dj -if price isn’t too high –also sweet lou would be a nice addition —so pistons will be shorthanded tomorrow —so much for all the avery Bradley trade ideas for the cavs
So the Clips are blowing it up. Only worth trading left are DJ, Lou and Milos (which is likely untouchable). Everyone would press hard on Beverly only if he’s healthy.
After seeing this trade I think chances are it’s only a matter of time before DJ gets here which I’m not yet 100% sold on. If it includes LouWill, say goodbye to the Nets pick.
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/958120746169053184
The Clips made out like Ainge.
Koby should be calling both the Clips and the Pistons to see if he can get in on this… if there was a way to get DeAndre and Lou W (if Clips are blowing up and starting over) plus Bradley from the Pistons for some assortment of IT, TT, Shump, JR, Rose, etc…. it would probably be worth moving the Nets pick…
Its possible now that he would, but wonder if Clips will want that BKN pick, Cavs have to get those two guys to make it worth it, otherwise its a blown trade worse than Celtics from the summer.
https://twitter.com/BobbyMarks42/status/958116530725761026
Woj Bomb…
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/958113159973408771
Wow that would be cool.
by two coaches who shouldn’t be GMs
I don’t think Doc is the GM anymore, is he?
He is. Though West seems to be calling the shots based on the moves.
Um… no
http://www.latimes.com/sports/clippers/la-sp-clippers-rivers-gm-20170804-story.html
Replaced as GM in August by Lawrence Frank…
Hate to do this to Zz but oh well…
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y7y3auzz
Well seems like Marjanovic is going to LA :(
Some of these trades got me thinking… if we trade 5 for 2 players… (1) do we need pick up players to fill out the roster? and (2) Who might be available, i.e., already on the street??
I LIKE THAT TRADE —-IF UTAH LIKES IT —PULL THE TRIGGER
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ybebrohf
Completely correct the terrible trade and win a title.
not entirely sure Utah answers the phone on this but a boy can dream, eh? :)
I’m also giving them the Brooklyn pick
Cavs definitely make a move. Just don’t want to make the wrong move or overpay. Isaiah is gone, IMO. His attitude can’t be endearing him to anyone.
moving IT would be a shocking trade…i don’t see them moving him at all, regardless, Lue will figure something out to limit any liability with him on floor. Least surprising would be moving Shumpert, Frye, or Osman, Rose, combo of those for a player. I also doubt they utilize any draft picks, even their own. Just think the deadline will come and go with minor moves, much like the lineup ‘change’.
Why would that be shocking? Certainly Frye and Osman, probably Rose, and maybe even Shumpert are more valuable. IT is a net minus at this point; the team is better when he is off the floor, and he is a trouble maker.
I would imagine it’ll be Dan saving face.
Do you have any evidence that Dan would make a suboptimal move to save face, or are you just making that up for trolling purposes?
If so, please share.
We believe those guys are valuable than IT but the team doesn’t; so they won’t move him, they will move the others as other teams involved in a trade will want them or resign to fact to make salaries meet.
Honestly think if IT came off the bench and played 15-20 a night it wouldn’t be a disaster, it appears he doesn’t fit well with Lebron and Love.
do not look for any “major ” trade(s) as in previous years —-think dan has more / less given the directed ‘ to stand pat–no major deals “—just waiting this year out / LeBron’s decision —-THAT NETS PICK ISN’T GOING ANYWHERE
i wonder if Cavs will do surprise trade no one has really mentioned….i mean i don’t know what that is, but i just think that would be the probability here…i doubt team gets involved with more than other team, may be one to one trade.
Cleveland Writer Greg Swartz posted his Cavs Trade of the Day. Cavs get Kemba, MKG, Bradley – Detroit gets JR, IT, and Rose – Charlotte gets Shumpert, Marjanovic, Stanley Johnson, BKN pick. Would you do it?
What picks involved?
Only picked he mentioned was Brooklyn pick going to Charlotte
Lol. “only”
Looks good for the Cavs and Charlotte. Utterly horrible for the Pistons.
Yeah, haven’t seen many three teamers that make sense for every team….
any player “attempting ” to throw kev under the bus /or bad mouth him —–should be an immediate ticket to canton —just watching kev perform on the ct / and professionalism off the ct —yes if LeBron doesn’t come back –build your team around this guy —–watched 1 play in the game —cavs had a turnover / or long rebound for the pistons –kev was the omly cav TRULY sprinting his butt back to defend
Yeah, IT wore out his welcome rather quickly.
https://twitter.com/oldseaminer/status/957946410028228608
I pointed it out from the beginning.
In unrelated Cleveland news…
https://twitter.com/twithersAP/status/958030639890096128
FINALLY!
Now they should change their names to the Cleveland tribe
I’d love for them to go back to the Spiders. It would be a merchandise bonanza.
http://redesignthetribe.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/WahooRebrand_large-7_SPIDERS.jpg
http://redesignthetribe.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/WahooRebrand_large-28_SPIDERS.jpg
The kids would love this stuff!
This is good and long overdue. Wahoo was embarrassing. Not sure why they didn’t see that.
Why in the world would you say that? Having stayed at a lot of camp grounds, Motel 6’s, etc. in the West, I can assure you that Chief Wahoo is quite popular with Native Americans.
Are you seriously attempting to use you personal anecdotes at a motel 6 as representive of an ethnic group against whom America comitted genocide?
As someone that has worked with tribal groups (Caddo, Chickasaw, Choctaw, Cherokee, Sioux, Utes to name a few groups whose representatives and employees I have worked directly with and/or corresponded with) throughout my career, I have not had the same experience. From their perspectives it is completely understandable and usually comes up when discussing sports in casual conversation when I tell them I am a Cleveland fan. Frankly, I find it offensive as well.
And so what? It’s just a logo, if they don’t like then too bad. So because some people don’t like it needs to go away? Yeah that makes a lot of sense.
And as someone who has plenty of Native American friends, they love the logo so your opinion/experience is moot. So much history ingrained with the team/logo, but because some people have a problem it must be changed. Totally disagree with that rationale.
I find some of your posts offensive John B, but that doesn’t mean I think you shouldn’t be allowed to post. Ya feel me?
Really what posts? Cite them unless you are just a MAGA troll. What history do you have with that logo? Did your relative own or play for the Cleveland Indians? If so, name names and who you are? Otherwise you seem like an ethnocentric, culturally insensitive, boorish racist, that supposedly speaks for “friends” as you say. I never said that Raoul or anyone else couldn’t express their opinions. I simply expressed my experience as opposed to Raoul and clearly you are intellectually incapable of understanding that. Clearly, reading comprehension is not your strength. Congratulations on being comfortably numb. An undeniably… Read more »
IT wants his minutes staggered with Lebron. “We’ve got to play to our strengths. Just like Chris Paul and James Harden, they don’t play together at all times. We got to play to our strengths.”
You know what, for the first time, I agree with you IT. Lebron playing 35-38 minutes a night means you’ll play 10-13 minutes a night. I am all for that. You go to the pine and play with the bench. Sounds good to me.
https://twitter.com/oldseaminer/status/958019151104225280
Hehehe. Also down with that.
Me too.
Would the Orlando Magic be interested in IT?
For what, and what else would they be getting?
I would take Afflalo off their hands.
Dude. Afflolo is awful.
He would only be asked to play defense. I mean, I would take a whole bunch of other players before him, question is, who’s your willing trade partner?
Getting tyreke and keeping Boston from getting him should be paramount.
https://twitter.com/HPbasketball/status/958004893213536256
He also didn’t have a great net or d rating last year in Boston apparently (-1.72 d, and -2.16 net). So what do you trust, reputation and the eye test versus rating? They don’t seem to lineup for him. There could be a number of reasons for the this. His d rating may have been dragged down by playing with the Boston starters last year, or he could be a shump type guy who looks good guarding his man but gets toasted off ball. This year his injuries may have seriously tanked his play. I don’t think he was bad… Read more »
Avery Bradley would be guarding Kyrie, Derozan, Curry in playoffs if Cavs make finals. No brainer to get him. Stats might fail Avery but he is still one of the best defender at guard position. Is Pope available, another defender always gives Curry trouble.
Actually Detroit may be willing to trade Avery for Jae Crowder.
Bet they would, since they aren’t planning on paying Bradley, and Crowder is still on his cheap deal. OKC may well be interested in Bradley, too, after the Roberson injury. I don’t think OKC has much to give in trade, though.
I’d like to keep Crowder. I still think he’ll turn it around if we get a more cohesive unit.
He probably had a terrible net rating last year because he had to cover up all of ITs mistakes. This year? I don’t know.
Off ball he’s bad.
Stevens is really looking like genius. Kyrie has bought in, and all the seemingly solid players that left (Crowder, IT, Bradley…) have turned to s#@t.
It was so clear to nearly everyone on this blog that IT was useless every time we played the Celtics. How can korby not have known? Don’t they use analytics? I just can’t believe a nets first and crowder was the best deal out there. Gilbert is such a tool.
Ironically, it might have been a better deal if they took the other expiring PG in Marcus Smart… at least he can play D…
I am sure the cavs FO considered the Brooklyn pick as the main part of that deal with LBJ’s impending free agency. That could turn into gold or it could just be ok. It remains to be seen how lucky the cavs are. You get any one of Bagley, Doncic, Young, or Ayton and it would be well worth it. If you don’t then you still might be able to get Bamba which would likely help the d in a few years or Sexton who could be good, or Porter who is an unknown now and an injury risk, but… Read more »
So uhm.. this trade works at the trade machine.
Avery Bradley+George Hill = Cavs
Shump+Rose = Pistons
Stanley Johnson+IT+Crowder+Zz = Kings
Detroit would definitely need picks in that trade…
Yeah but I guess we now have a foundation of something.
Yeah no way Detroit is accepting that platter of garbage without something more. They would be giving up a useful player with bird rights and a young guy for basically a bad contract and one of the worst players in the NBA. I am sure the kings would take that package.
IT can be traded to a team that is still hopeful of making playoffs, needs a starting point and can put 4 plus defenders with him(IT said, it is ‘disrespectful’ to come off bench). Either that or if teams want to get rid of some long term contract, trade for IT and buy him out.
Which team is that?
Long shot. Cousins is gone for season, may be Pelicans wants IT to fill in starter position that is vacant, move AD to C and Jrue to 2. What would Cavs get in return, not sure, but a distant possibility. Andre Roberson is out for OKC, so they have a spot open there, he will fit very well in iso-only offense there. MDA always wants scorers off bench, and he rarely minds non defense so far as the player can score. I think any rotation player that Cavs get in return can help Cavs better than IT.
Maybe. Don’t know what teams out there that are borderline playoff teams fit that description. Detroit has Jackson already. Obviously the most realistic trade would be for him as an expiring for a salary dump.
Ugh, Avery Bradley is an unrestricted FA this summer. But heck if it’s for Shump/Rose/IT/JR combo or all of them I’d do it. We BADLY NEED a guy like him. Been clamouring for him since the Kyrie saga.
Bradley would be a fantastic pick up, for sure.
He’s going to want the Brinks Truck, too…all these guys should be sending bags of money to President Stevens for making them look better than they are…
Cavs would get his Bird rights though if they traded for him which makes it a little more palatable…
See below. Bradley has played way below his rep this year.
Tyreke Evans might be even better than Bradley.
Offensively no question. I know Brad Stevens helped Bradley a lot, but he’s still better defensively.
With regards to fit in this team, I’d still pick Bradley. Avery’s post season experience also trumps Evans’.
KJG writing Avery Bradley might be on the trade table—ALL IN ON THAT—IT / SHUMP / MAYBE ANTE FOR BRADLEY
That would be robbery
I’d give IT a piggyback ride to the airport for that trade!
Bradley has been fighting injuries all year…I’m not too high on him right now, but he has traditionally defended GS well…but that was in a better defensive system, too. I mostly worry that he’s largely a product of President Stevens’ system.
He’s still leaps and bounds than what we currently have. Id take the risk as long as no picks given.
Curious why people think IT doesn’t get moved?
I don’t know if he will or not, but he is a PG who was good last season, and the Cavs mostly have a tire fire at the PG position currently…he’s also a ‘name’ player, which is something that was reported last summer that Gilbert wanted in return for KI…
Unless he runs himself out of town with his mouth, I doubt he’s traded…
Too small a contract to be valuable in a cash dump and the fact that no one is going to pay him what he wants. Teams know his limitations and those are on full display with him on the Cavs. His exposure has limited his trade value. Plus Gilbert likes the short guys, he’d also have to admit that he got taken to the cleaners by Ainge.
Obviously him as an actual player, he is not appealing now. However, as part of a package with another piece, it would be an expiring plus something else like the cavs first rounder. That might get it done.
The cavs would be dumb to factor pride into it. It would look worse to keep an unplayable guy than to admit he isn’t the player you thought he’d be and move him for something.
he was “salty–pouty ” when asked why he didn’t play the 4th —he is a “ME 1ST ‘ PLAYER —can’t believe (I have admitted it recently )– how much my attitude has changed in 2 weeks towards I.T.—-AND NOT BECAUSE OF HIS POOR PLAY—more so because of his toxic attitude —–did not see that coming —but he would be the 1st player I would try to trade / listen to in trade talks
listening to I.T. “pout ‘ again after the game ( not playing in the 4th )– he is a CANCER !!—-can’t believe I am saying this would prefer they move him more so than shump —be interesting how the cavs play tues night —-watched the replay—yes their defense did pick up in the 4th–BUT the pistons also missed a lot of open / good looks —–not trying to be the pessimist –but don’t believe the cavs ” have turned the corner yet ‘
I didn’t hear his comments, did he complain? But he is ‘Mr. Fourth Quarter’, so I wouldn’t be surprised…
Amazing that IT is now at the top of the list of “players we want traded ASAP”. And above Shump and Rose. Unreal.
It’s all about Tuesday night, Nomad. I’ll reserve my judgement on the Cavs having turned the corner until then, given the Pistons away-from-home / missing key players situation. I’ll say this though – I enjoyed the way the Cavs played the game, nice to see the old guard producing & starting to sync with this year’s recruits. May this continue. PS I hope people recognise what a key part of this team KLove is, and not just from an on-court perspective. Dude is so relaxed & spends more time interacting with his teammates on the sidelines during the game than… Read more »
i don’t think offense is ever the problem with this team…they can drop 120+ anytime they want. What was encouraging was the defense in which they only allowed 43 second half points. Yes Detroit is a bad team but have to start somewhere and make some positive strides. The complaints on IT are somewhat agreeable…though I did see JR get abused on defense multiple times but he made it up with making 3s. IT won’t go anywhere he just has to find a solid lineup and maybe not pairing with Lebron is it, however weird that may be. Having Frye… Read more »
I can’t find anyone really in support of IT, and for good reason. The local media seems to be turning against him. I hope he’s shipped out for anything. The team is obviously better without him, plus his attitude is clearly toxic.
Agree with Jason, very surprised at the tone of this recap
Cavs are still the favorites in the east because of their offense. It doesn’t feel like any of the other East teams can keep up. They even had an extended lull from about the 4 minute mark of the 1st quarter through halfway into the 2nd, and still ended up with 120
Rose and Wade can’t play at the same time . For the team this year, Channing Frye is more valuable than George Hill would be because he makes the second unit so much more logical
I respectfully disagree, guys. Before IT’s short 3rd quarter burst, he was a team low in +/-. The ball was sticking in his hands. Sure, he made a few shots here and there but the offensive momentum clearly halted. And while the perimeter lapses were often a result of Rose and JR, there were a lot of problems with IT. The Pistons often switched IT underneath, forcing him to cover lobs and paint play. Drummond was just catching the ball above his head. Of course, that isn’t because he isn’t a skilled basketball player, he just can’t affect passes in… Read more »
Disagree that the Cavs are still the favorites in the East. Absolutely no team has had a statistically last rated defense, and advance beyond the second round of a conference playoff. Ever. Look it up. And it won’t happen with the Cavs either. If the Cavs play defense like in the 4th quarter – albeit without IT and against a team reeling with 7 consecutive losses – the Cavs could advance with LeBron. A good playoff team will of course be more effective than the Pistons on offense. And I think the tone of the recap jived with what I… Read more »
How does Frye replace the worst point guard situation in the NBA? That’s where hill’s value comes. Even if he’s average he is light years better than it and rose. Plus he is still shooting 45% from three.
whats interesting is that despite Cavs deep fall into the abyss the Celtics and Raptors have not increased their leads in standings, either same or slightly worse.
Raptors offense has improved a lot, perhaps 3rd best offensive team behind warriors and rockets and Celtics are best defensive team in east. Lebron has to put up amazing numbers from round I for Cavs to win while playing both ends. Lebron is still putting gaudy MVP numbers but he has slowed down, you could see in how he is slow to get back on D this year, he needs help more than before. Unless Cavs somehow get a all defensive team kind of player(Marc Gasol, and to some extend Favors, Avery Bradley if healthy fits that bill). Cavs better… Read more »
Thought this recap diverged from reality a bit and the bias of the author showed a bit. Thomas was +4 for the game. He was fine last night. 14 and 7 with 1 TO. 5/12 shooting. A couple forced shots but Love & Bron also had a couple. IT had nothing to do with Tolliver’s big quarter. The bad D was more of a Rose/JR /LeBron thing early. Harris going by Bron early. Then Ish by Rose. Then JR kept losing Bullock.
Cannot believe I am defending IT but that cap was a little too biased for me.
Totally disagree. JR may have played bad defense but the Pistons were running 75% of their half court offense to exploit Isaiah when he was on the floor. He was their whole offense. The only reason Thomas got a reprieve was cause Luke Kenard came in and stunk up the arena in the third quarter blowing 3 wide open scoring opportunities.
Half of the other guys being out of position in the second and third was guys scrambling to cover the guy now open due to it’s crappiness. I’ll admit that I didn’t see the first ten minutes of the first
I have to agree with you as well Jason. Are we forgetting a guy just came back from an extremely serious injury and has barely played ten games with this team, hardly enough time to build chemistry and find his rhythm? Like IT said so succcinctly, this team was bottom five defense before he came in. I’m willing to give him some more time, and if he fails, then we trade him at the deadline for George Hill or some other bigger, better defensive PG. I think Channing needs to stay in town PERIOD! I love his game and professionalism… Read more »
Haven’t read one of your posts I’ve disagreed with, LACF. +several.
Yeah but what IT does not understand is that he made a bad situation far worse. Cavs may have been bottom five on defense but they became dead last with him starting. And it’s not as if IT is shooting efficiently or setting up teammates or playing defense or grabbing rebounds or what else. Surely even he realizes that he is not adding value if he is not shooting well. Is it a coincidence that both offense and defense were really bad once he was inserted in the starting five? IT also does not understand that talking too much and… Read more »
Eh, with the exception of his offensive flurry in the third that improved his +/- IT was still a huge minus defensively… But then again, he always has been and likely always will be. I’ve never really liked his game, but had hopes he could turn into more of a facilitator/spot up shooter in this offense given that he wouldn’t have to shoulder the load offensively. Sadly, it doesn’t appear that IT can be effective offensively unless he’s completely ball-dominant, thus Lue has begun the separation/staggering of him and LeBron… As several have said, he’s just much better suited to… Read more »
I’m fine if IT is actually traded. Ok I really want IT traded. Everyday I hear from him the more I tend to dislike him. He is a me-first player at this point of his career. I ain’t saying that’s totally bad but I really don’t think he’s as into this as Kyrie was when he’s here. His main and secondary objective is to get back from his “level”. Not that we wouldn’t welcome an all-star level of play, but he’s not a fit for this team as constructed. We may get nostalgic because he’s got some offensive similarities with… Read more »
You’re 100pct right. IT is only a weapon when you have a good coach who can come up with O and D to maximize his skill set. That’s what Brad Stevens was able to do for him. Ty Lue? Nowhere near as smart.