Kevin’s Big Board, #11 – #20…what to do with the nineteenth pick (or, now I’m just trolling you)
2013-06-25Writing sixty of these, and putting in the necessary care to ensure that I am uneqivocally correct, now and later, about all of them, is exhausting. But I forge on. Time to move towards the lottery and offer some thoughts on the #19 pick.
#20 – Allen Crabbe, California, SG, 21 years old – For both size and athleticism, Crabbe graded out as extremely similar to Reggie Bullock, a favorite of Cavalier fans. The only discernible distinctions in the their combine results are that Crabbe is longer (2.5″ for wingspan, 1.5″ for reach) and significantly faster at shuffling his feet through cones (10.67 compared to 11.33 seconds in the agility drill). An accomplished shooter, he converted 54% of his open jumpers this year and 44% coming off of screens. Asked to handle a larger offensive load than the Tar Heel, and being a full year younger, he offers a nice package of size and floor spacing from the wing.
#19 – Giannis Adetokunbo, Filathlitikos (Greece), SF, 18 years old – This a complete “imagination” pick; the guy is basically a high school senior. He’s 6′ – 9″ with long arms, huge hands, and promising perimeter skills as a ball-handler and passer. Playing in a low-level Greek league, scouts were wary of reading too much into his decent, yet non-dominant performance there. Greatly improving his stock in two recent games against Croatia and Turkey’s U20 teams, he offered 11 points, 6 rebounds and 4 assists against the former, and 17 points and 5 rebounds in 20 minutes against the latter. Beginning a four-year stint in the Spanish ACB next year, he will still be 22 years old at the start of the 2017 – 2018 NBA season, so he serves as a definite pick for those with a longview.
#18 – Gorgui Dieng, Louisville, C, 23 years old – I really like Gorgui Dieng. I like that he blocked nearly 10% of opponent two point attempts. I like that he coupled that with 44 steals in 33 games. I like that he had more assists than turnovers, thanks to a good eye from the high post. I like the 66% free throw shooting and that he made 50% of his jumpers this year (via draftexpress). I like that he ranked 2nd in the Big East for defensive rebound rate and 7th for offensive rebound rate. And I like that Louisville is the national champions, thanks to back-to-back seasons as the NCAA’s best adjusted defense (via kenpom.com). I think he pretty clearly separates himself from Jeff Withey and Rudy Gobert.
#17 – Michael Carter-Williams, Syracuse, PG, 21 years old – Take five minutes and look through the Draftexpress measurements database. Try to find a point guard that was 6’ – 5” barefoot with a 31.5” no-step vertical leap, a 10.68 agility drill and a 3.22 sprint time. You couldn’t? With that size and averaging over seven assists per game, he is really unique. Despite all that, I’ll leave him outside the lottery. He struggles in the pick and roll and doesn’t shoot well (39 / 29 / 69)…plus he’s tall…and he passes well; I’ve seen a Shaun Livingston comparison thrown around, but when talking about elite picks, is that good enough? He turns 22 before the start of the season and needs to acclimate to man-to-man defense; can’t place him above…
#16 – Shane Larkin, Miami, PG, 20 years old – Making up for his small stature by being a ridiculous athlete, he finished top five in this class for no-step vertical leap, sprint speed, and agility drill…if you recall, that matters for point guards. He also paced the NCAA in points created in the pick & roll and scored 24 points per game while leading Miami to the ACC tourney championship. Also one year younger than MCW, you read this right, second best point guard in the class.
#15 – Shabazz Muhammad, UCLA, SF, 20 years old – It’s getting late…what is there to say about Shabazz? He isn’t tall, or terribly athletic. He wasn’t particularly efficient on offense, nor did he rack up counting stats on defense. He doesn’t create well for himself in the half-court. Or others, as he turned the ball over twice for every single assist.
On the bright side, he broke Dirk Nowitzki’s record for scoring at the 2012 Nike Hoop Summit. Hence, all is salvaged and I keep him in the top fifteen.
#14 – C.J. McCollum, Lehigh, SG, 21 years old – Every year I undervalue a small school player; this year it may be McCollum. In 2011 – 2012, his last full season, McCollum posted a 114 orating on 33 usage with a pure point rating of 0.4 as a 6’ – 2” combo guard playing a very weak schedule; the NCAA’s 282nd toughest according to kenpom.com. Erick Green is over a year older than McCollum was then, but as a 6’ – 2” combo guard, he posted a 120 orating on 32 usage with 0.9 PPR against the NCAA’s 56th toughest schedule. I am oversimplifying, but is one a top-ten pick and the other a second rounder? I’ll say “no”, and rank them a bit closer than that.
#13 – Kelly Olynyk, Gonzaga, PF / C, 22 years old -In the last ten years, Olynyk’s senior season PER of 37 ranks among the NCAA’s best. Other extremely elite PER marks above 36 came from Blake Griffin, Danny Granger, Andrew Bogut, Dejuan Blair, Michael Beasley, Mike Sweetney, Nick Fazekas, and John Bryant during that time. That is a solid group, but obviously does not guarantee success. It sounds like Olynyk is shooting very well in workouts, and I am willing to buy into him as a multifaceted, offensively talented power forward, that when paired with a rim protecting center, can make an impact in the NBA.
#12 – Steven Adams, Pittsburg, C, turns 20 in July – Every analytics-based article I read likes Adams. And how can they not? Top 25 in the NCAA for offensive rebound rate and percentage of opponent two-pointers blocked, he did damage as a freshman. Plus, a seven-footer, weighing 255 lbs, and with a 3.40 sprint time? What’s not to like?
#11 – Lucas Nogueira, ASEFA Estudiantes (Spanish ACB), C, turns 21 this summer – Look at this article and compare Nogueira to Rudy Gobert. Nogueira is better at everything other than getting to the free throw line, plus Gobert ranked first for True Shooting with Nogueira second; Lucas was even a better shot blocker. All with the big Brazilian being slightly younger and playing in a more difficult league. Nogueira tested as faster and more agile, and has the second highest no-step vertical reach in the 2013 draft class (behind only D.J. Stephens). Until recently, Gobert typically ranked above Nogueira in mock drafts, but there is a clear distinction between the two, and it favors the Brazilian. Finally, a 24 PER in the ACB at age 20 is a really fricking stellar.
Now time for a recommendation on the 19th pick: Clearly Adetokunpo or Nogueira, to finish forming my super team of young ACB players.
Ok, Crabbe or Bullock would be cool, too.
Also, if Adetokunpo is basically a high school senior, does that mean we can just grap Wiggins or Parker?!
Grant has said nobody in this draft can or will start for us next year, at least to start. They will pick up a 3 no matter what so there is not going to be this glaring weak link there.
Also, Nate, the Mavericks cannot trade their pick until after the draft unless we give them 19 due to the Stepien rule.
True. But I’d like the idea of putting someone who hit 43% on 3 pt shots on the court with Kyrie and Dion.
We can trade for Pierce, trade for Marion, or sign a FA SF. There’s more than one way to skin a cat.
@ Ross “I’ve heard numerous “experts” state that late first round choices and second round choices pan out as quality NBA role players about 1 out of 4 times.” Perhaps. I’ve also heard that this particular is deeper than most. It’s not top-heavy, but the odds of finding a quality player after the lottery picks are better than usual. If they do end up trading 19 for T. Rob, I’m not saying it’s really bad move (in fact, I believe I suggested trying to trade for him a few weeks ago). But it will leave a glaring hole at SF… Read more »
A is Thomas Robinson, B is Tristan Thompson, both from this past season (their 21 year old seasons). At the same time, it was Robinson’s rookie year split between two franchises and it was Tristan’s sophomore campaign after he made a big jump from his rookie year. I don’t think getting a better player at the #19 this year is better than a 25% chance. I’ve heard numerous “experts” state that late first round choices and second round choices pan out as quality NBA role players about 1 out of 4 times.
Very similar, Player B clearly a bit more advanced (especially on offense) but I wouldn’t call it a huge disparity.
Per 36 Minutes
Player A
11.4 points, 10.7 boards, .451 TS, 90 off rtg on 19.1% usage, 2% steal rate, 1.9% block rate
Player B
13.4 points, 10.9 boards, .516 TS, 98 off rtg on 19.2% usage, 1% steal rate, 3.3% block rate
Guess who?
@ Ross Well, the fact that he was a top 5 pick shouldn’t matter. It would seem that he was drafted higher than he should have been. If they are drafting Noel #1, I’d rather that they use that pick to get someone who can contribute quickly and will be on the floor more than a backup PF. Especially since Noel will be sitting until at least Christmas. Maybe using #19 to fill the hole at SF would work better. Reggie Bullock would be my preference. If they end up working a trade with Dallas and use #13 to pick… Read more »
@ Cody
How can you not like getting a top 5 pick coming off his rookie year for the #19? What is not to like about that deal? If Houston offered that, I think Grant would be greedy to even try to get more from Houston or give up less than the #19.
IMO, that’s a steal on par with what Memphis gave us in the Speights/Ellington deal.
@Notsure Totally on board with a trade for MKG. #1 isn’t worth nearly enough this year for #4 and MKG. Maybe a future pick, Zeller and #1. The more I thought about Thomas Robinson, the more I’m okay with the 19th pick for him. He struggled his rookie year, but nearly all bigs do. He’s athletic and has offensive moves. He can finish Kyrie and Waiters oops above the rim. Being in Sacramento then being traded to the Rockets (McHale is notorious for not playing rookies) couldn’t have helped. The value of this draft is in the late lottery and… Read more »
Cavs podcast with Chris Mannix from SI.
http://www.stationcaster.com/player_skinned.php?s=70&c=1441&f=1567471
Found this about T. Robinson:
http://blog.chron.com/ultimaterockets/2013/06/rockets-in-advanced-talks-on-trade-for-thomas-robinson/
I like the idea of picking him up, but not for #19.
I’ve been seeing rumors of Charlotte shopping MKG. Anyone think the Cavs should/would try to get him, maybe offer the #1 in a package for him and the #4 and take Vico/Len or even Cody Zeller?
@ Kevin Excellent work on the series. I’ve enjoyed reading them, and looking forward to the blog tomorrow night. Especially if Grant makes an unexpected pick…man, does the blog explode! Nogueira at 13? Yeah, he’ll be there. If they pass on Noel, it makes sense. For that matter, so would Steven Adams. 13 seems high for a stash, though. It’s not as if the Cavs are so talented that they couldn’t find someone at 13 to contribute immediately. I suppose if it’s for one year, it’s OK. Does anyone have an idea about when he’d come over? @ Cory Hughey… Read more »
Also, Kevin, it’s funny to see these small school guards consistently flummox you. I’m sure you have a dart board with Damian Lillard’s face on it.
The problem with the Mavs/Marion trade: as I noted yesterday, the Mavs can’t trade him till he opts in for next year, which he has through Friday to do. Then he and the Mavs both have to send a letter to the league before he can be traded. So, it’s a giant game of chicken. They’ve probably told Marion that if he opts in, they’re trading him, basically daring him not to take the option. So… my bet is that the Mavs call the Cavs and say, “we’re taking Karasev or Nogueira. If Marion opts in, we’ll give you the… Read more »
Thanks for the effort, just one more post! a couple of days and you can rest for a while, really awesome work for prepare write all this stuff for us.
I’m interested Thomas Robinson if it comes at a future draft pick. Buy when the market is low and sell when it’s high. If nothing else he can be a backup rotation big at a lower cap number than Speights. Maybe the Cavs eat Royce White’s deal for a year (Canton Charge!) and send Houston the Sacramento pick or something. I don’t see there being a major logjam in the frontcourt either when you consider that Len/Noel won’t be ready for the start of the season and Andy’s lengthy injury history. Realistically if the Cavs do make a big fish… Read more »
Thanks everyone.
Kj,
Yeah…Nogueira…we’re in agreement about him. Would he be available at #13 in the hypothetical Mavs trade?
Cory Hughey,
If Thomas Robinson is available for the Sac pick, that would be cool.
If i’m a GM i am exploring every, EVERY possible angle – trades, picks, you name it. Basically not sleeping. I’d bet there is an enormous file on every pick and every trade target. I’d also be floating trial balloons, randomly strewing disinformation… I’d bet that the Cavs are still offering random picks for #13 & Marion, simply because not many think it’s a bad idea. p.s. I like the idea the blog is offering that is a great year to stock up on stash-ables. Heck, maybe we should be adding 2nd rounders? Anyway – thanks for the truly insane… Read more »
The draft is two days away. Thanks to Kevin and all the writers for all your hard work putting these profiles, stories, and analyses together. This website has been awesome. I also commend all the astute bloggers. I am not aware of any other sight with as knowledgeable a group. I’ve enjoyed the thoughts and insight from you all. I don’t know what I’m going to do with myself after the draft is over. I’m thinking/hoping we can pick up Bullock or Karesev (if Grant thinks he can play D) with our 2nd pick – wherever it is. It’s notable… Read more »
As I mentioned in another thread, Pelton has Bebe ranked as the 6th best player. I think it would be amazing to trade out of the 1st pick, get Porter then get Bebe who is a not-very-poor-man’s-Noel. Seriously, Kevin, Bebe is closer to Noel than he is to Rudy…