Antagonistic, Slapdash Recap: Bobcats 86, Cavs 80
2013-11-15
The C:TB mansion is aflame. Nate is passed out, face-in-the-dirt on the front lawn, and Patrick is still shuddering, wild-eyed, occasionally murmuring something incoherent about “The Wet, Black Noise.” I may never learn what horrors befell my staff while I was out buying skirt steak and face wash at Jewel. In lieu of a recap—I must tend to my staff!—this excerpt from Ottessa Moshfegh’s “Bettering Myself” must suffice:
I’d been up on bad cocaine and drinking for days. I’d roped a few men back to my apartment and showed them all my belongings, stretched out flesh-colored tights and proposed we take turns hanging each other. Nobody lasted more than a few hours.
Kyrie Irving finished with 18 points on 5-for-16 shooting. Hold each other close tonight, friends.
Well, Kyrie sure came up big last night. He needed a game like that.
Btw, Lloyd is reporting it was not Dion not “a large part” of the supposed confrontation at the players meaning.
Huh. Pre-game I said we need to go with 3 guards and move Kyrie off the ball and taaadahhhh! We win! Whaddya know?
Again, Dion and Jack need to play PG with Kyrie off the ball at least 15-18 minutes a night. The dribbling, turnover-probe, inefficient Kyrie has to be curtailed as much as possible.
Btw, if Dion was concerned about getting touches, he was absolutely right to say so to Kyrie.
If that’s true, that’s very disheartening. Dion is one of the few guys that seem to want to be a leader on this team. If he’s getting into it with other players, that isn’t good for us. At all.
Having second thoughts. Just now reading stories of controversy involving Cavs players . . . and Dion being a large part of it. The story suggested Dion wasn’t ill last night – just told to stay home. If that’s the case – then Brown can’t get it done . . . because I think the Cavs players are nearly the nicest bunch of athletes ever assembled.
So, the Cavs can succeed with Brown as coach – taking advantage of his strengths. But they need to find the best offensive coach possible, and Brown needs to turn it entirely over to him.
We brought in a coach for the offense. Brown needs to turn it entirely over to him. If he doesn’t get it done, we need a new guy. I’m sure our offense coach doesn’t have a 5 year contract. Aside from that, we just dribble too much. Ball movement would solve half the problem with the offense. Dion excels when he gets lots of touches. (Actually, most players do.) If you play basketball and you’re in a game that you don’t get touches, you usually fire it up or try to do too much when you do get the ball.… Read more »
All of you guys are making good points.
I agree with the folks saying that the solution is to play Kyrie off the ball more. It just seems as if the offense right now is not conducive to getting him to good spots on the floor, and we’re relying too much on him to create for everyone including himself. It’s clearly not working given that the team is playing so inefficiently and missing way too many shots (especially Kyrie himself).
I think if that issue is solved, it’ll fix a lot of the offensive issues.
Look, Dion started out pretty well at Minny and then got no touches after. Kyrie froze him out. Kylie’s hero ball is the problem here esp when, ya know, he’s not actually being the hero.
As I said, our PG play has been awful and the only way this gets turned around is if we see Dion and Jack with Kyrie and Kyrie playing off the ball. Kyrie’s trust issues have to be solved. He needs to look in the mirror.
Not sure what is going on with this team. They have terrible body language. I see Zeller and Bennett on the court – heads down, no energy, playing error laden dumb basketball. Almost like they don’t want to be on the court. Irving – pressing his offense to the point of going out of control and committing numerous turnovers. I can take the cavs playing smart, hard basketball and coming up short. This is bad basketball, with low energy, and many mistakes – i see lots of frustration on the court.
Windhorst is reporting lockeroom contention already:
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9986199/cleveland-cavaliers-held-confrontational-players-only-meeting
@WindhorstESPN: Cavs players confront each other at player’s only meeting: http://t.co/fuhIU68q7r
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9986199/cleveland-cavaliers-held-confrontational-players-only-meeting
That would explain the chemistry issues.
Rich, I only mentioned Scott in passing, that you have to keep bringing him up shows how weak your argument is. If you can’t make proper comparisons because you don’t have the data, I can’t help you. As for you actually providing an area that Brown may be weak – rotations, let’s look at the actual data instead of your inaccurate ranting. The Cavs brought in subs from 5 mins to go in the 3rd to 2 mins to go. Not all at once. They had 5 bench guys on the court for all of 1:42. Albeit, they didn’t play… Read more »
Oh, since we’re playing the Wiz tonight, I would point out to the Dion haters that Beal is a volume scorer. Shooting 40%.
Perspective…
Indiana had a 3-6 record last year.
We are the 2nd youngest team in the league. 15 of the 16 playoff teams last year were the oldest 15 teams in the league.
Some perspective…
Anybody else sick of the “hard show” that our bigs do on defense, when defending the PNR? This is where our big – normally Andy – jumps out on a pick sometimes as high as the 3 pt arc and lets his man roll to the hoop resulting in a situation where the opposing team has a 2 on 1 against the other big (Thompson normally). This is good for 3-4 layups per game for the opponents. Sometimes at crucial junctures. Why such a hard jump out?? Looks like the cavs and Andy waste alot of energy on simply defending… Read more »
A lot of great points made here. Thank you for saying what most of us want to. Try not to take it out on each other. We’re are very frustrated to see our Cavs fail like this. Be nice to see a shining light somewhere in all of this.
1 time! That was the total number of times I saw or big man roll off a pick. I have been a big fan of Mike Brown over the years, but if his offensive sets include telling our ball handler to cross the opposing big and for our big to pop EVERY TIME, then I’m off board. We are not attacking the hoop with or without the ball. Only once did we see Kyrie come around, take the dribble handoff that turns into a side PnR, and the actually accept the double team to give Andy an open layup. The… Read more »
Even though the Cavs played relatively well defensively last night–you should win when holding a team to 86 points–what about the previous game when the Timberwolves scored 32, 38, and 32 points in each of the 1st three quarters? The lack of both effort and consistency is taking its toll. Agree with some other comments here–send Bennett to the D league for a couple of weeks. Settle on a starting 5, and an 8- or 9-man rotation that mixes starters with subs, get the ball out of Kyrie’s hands…maybe let him play more at the 2?; and obviously kick it… Read more »
Someone explain Bennett’s conditioning to me-how did a shoulder injury prevent him from at least riding a stationary bike?
Guy has double Ds flopping around out there. Awful.
Part of the problem is Brown’s offensive scheme is predicated on having one of the best players in the NBA. He doesn’t have that here and the offensive issues he has become magnified. We can blame the players all we want, but they run some of the worst offensive sets in the NBA.
Atleast last year we saw sparks of what the offense could be last year. This year I haven’t seen any of that promise. The offense is one of the worst I have ever watched in the nba. There is absolutely no flow or cohesiveness whatsoever
People need to stop making excuses. The offense looks like a shitty college basketball team out there it’s pathetic. I don’t think I have ever watched a cavs team with less chemistry.
Two big numbers 24.0 and 3.1. Those represent the average age and average years of NBA experience. Average age is a virtual tie with Philly and only Phoenix has a lower avg for NBA years. Still young and lots of new moving parts with a coach that doesn’t coach much offense. Going to be lots of growing pains.
The problem is this team doesn’t play with effort. It was clear in the 2nd half that the Bobcats knew they could up the effort and the game was theirs. All MKG did was attack the glass, dare the Cavs to cover him and hit shots and Kemba really gets under the Cavs guards skins because he’s an in your face guy. Kyrie not only isn’t hitting shots but he is playing like his Uncle Drew character. Just dribble around and hope a fancy dribble move or shake will confuse the guy and he’s open for a basket. Doesn’t work… Read more »
It kind of sounds ridiculous to send the first overall pick down to the D League, but it might help Bennett get his confidence back and play himself into shape. I can’t imagine that Hetzel’s offense is worse than Brown’s. Coming off the bench for 10 minutes a night and randomly set picks and watch Jack jack up the ball from the elbow isn’t helping his development at all.
Rich,
Get your resume ready. I’m sure some NBA team will be calling you soon.
You want another example? These continuous rotations where we have 5 bench players on the court for 4-5 minutes at a time. Third quarter, up 6, all starters are subbed out and by the time they get back in we’re down 3. Andi t’s every game with that nonsense. 5 bench players all at once. Instead of staggering the minutes of the three best players (Kyrie, Dion and Andy) we allow a front-court of Bennett and Zeller and a back-court of Jack and Karasev/Delly/Random Bench Person to play 5 straight minutes together, and it NEVER works. But hey, tell me… Read more »
I have no idea why your so defensive and angry with me. Where did I go at you? I did demonstrate and easy to understand coaching error and your response was “well that’s micro.” Bravo for ignoring it. He also blew two other timeouts. Now, to say “Well at least he calls timeouts” is not to defend his actual use of them. Great, he uses them better than Byron Scott? SO WHAT?? Still not good. Still wasting them to the detriment of the team. But, what we really have is a totally stagnant offense in the fourth quarter. Kyrie dribbles,… Read more »
You have said absolutely nothing that would convince anyone you know what you’re talking about. Rambling about how many games you’ve watched? Seriously? That’s the best you got? Because defending Hughes, Jamison, and Bennett’s offensives performances in a Cavs uniform certainly isn’t the best you got (you sure you watched those games?). Kyrie doesn’t look like someone who forgot to play offense, he looks like someone who can’t hit a shot right now, and teams are responding to that by not giving him the lane. Unless you’ve got some hard evidence that Brown changes Irving’s shot, you’ve got nothing. Maybe,… Read more »
I have no confidence that the Cavs win 24 games this year based on what I’ve seen.
I think the biggest adjustment seems to be changing from playing a running (no defense, but look to steal) style of play with Scott to a more conservative half court stanky leg (but 5 men on a defensive string) Brown offense. Obviously if the team makes the playoffs Browns system should sustain. Unfortunately, they look far from a playoff team.
I really don’t care about Byron Scott. He doesn’t coach this team. I care about Mike Brown being hired before anyone else was interviewed and given a five year contract.
My man, I’ve followed Mike Brown’s entire career with a close eye. I’ve seen probably 80% of the games Mike Brown has coached. All your first paragraph taught me was this: LeBron James carried Mike Brown. The man cannot coach offense. He’s never been able to do it. He still can’t do it. It’s funny how we used to blame every single player that the Cavs brought it in. Never Mike’s fault. But you know what? Maybe Larry Hughes really wasn’t that bad. MAybe Jamison didn’t suddenly turn extremely inefficient on his own. Maybe Anthony Bennett isn’t the worst number… Read more »
Well, I guess if the issues with Brown are so micro (seriously, we’re bitching about that timeout?) things aren’t that bad. You know who looked like an idiot? Byron Scott standing there silent with his arms folded while no one on his roster showed the least bit of interest in playing winning defense.
Rich, if you were here for the Krolik days, then you know that LeIso in the last five minutes was one of the most effective offenses that the league had seen. It’s the exact same offense you see from almost every team, the problem right now is that Irving is not playing like a superstar – that’s not on Mike Brown. We saw this play out among the fanbase for years, and I guess we still haven’t learned – Brown is going to get blamed for everything that goes wrong. Forget that he’s taken over a 24 win team that… Read more »
Problem is we’re still paying Scott and Mike Brown was given a FIVE YEAR contract. Without interviewing anyone. Five years.
So unless Gilbert is really, really upset and really, really doesn’t care about throwing money into the toilet, he stays for the year, at least.
LA didn’t wait this long on Mike Brown.
Well at least he’s calling time outs.
I get the hate for Mike Brown. 1 point game, 10 seconds left in the third quarter, and he calls a timeout to yell at a guy? Can’t wait 10 seconds and save the timeout in a close game? There is so much stupid in that one decision that it has to make guys feel like they are playing for an idiot. And they are.
I think we’ll probably turn it around. The turnovers were generating points tonight. We just gotta find some rhythm. Also liking each other has a lot more to do with winning than I guess I used to think. These guys don’t trust each other, they are griping at each other, and they seem to really really hate Mike Brown. Never seen such uncaring faces during a timeout.
No, listen, I’m more than willing to put a big part of the blame on Brown. I have NO IDEA what we’re doing in the last 6 minutes of games. None. Other than watch Kyrie dribble around and do nothing. That’s ALL on Mike Brown. Even if you say “well Mike wants them to do more” then Mike should probably call a time-out or two and let them know that and if Kyrie isn’t doing what’s he’s supposed to be doing then he should probably bench him until he gets it. These fourth quarter meltdowns on offense are all on… Read more »
I wouldn’t read too much into ESPN ranking Irving 8th best player. Kyrie definitely has star potential. I don’t think we need to expect great defense from our PG. Nash was awful defensively and was MVP. I know Irving has been struggling offensively but there are a handful of factors that come into play.
Rich, I’ll admit that I am trying to make excuses for Kyrie, but Byron’s system seemed to fit Kyrie better. And that is not a good thing. I’m willing to give Kyrie the benefit of the doubt because he has been the most consistent and best player over the past couple of years on the Cavs. He’s obviously struggling though, but Browns offensive schemes aren’t playing into his strengths. I’m hoping this is all growing pains, but frankly I’m not confident in the direction of this franchise.
Like, I don’t know a nice way of saying this, but the problem is this team doesn’t have a superstar. Kyrie is so far from that “8th best player” ranking ESPN gave him its depressing.
Lol. Only two pure shooters are Kyrie and CJ? Kyrie hasn’t been a pure shooter since January of last year. He’s like the 5th best 3-point shooter on this team right now. I have more confidence in Dion’s spot shooting than Kyrie at this point. And then there is Mike Brown and this offense. Forget this noise about having a bad defensive start to the fourth. It’s the NBA. EVENTUALLY THEY WILL FIND A WAY TO SCORE SOME POINTS. When your offense looks this bad night after night, even though you’re holding teams to sub 45% shooting, you’re going to… Read more »
Not sure where to start. This team is not fun to watch, not even remotely. Ten games in to the season and they look like they’ve already quit on Mike Brown. Guys weren’t even running hard with the Cavs down 7 with three minutes to go. Cavs appear to have a roster full of guys who aren’t enamored with the idea of playing defense being coach by a guy who cares only about defense. I agree that to be an elite team, you have to be very good defensively, (MIA, SA, IND, CHI) but it doesn’t look like they’ve assembled… Read more »
I agree Mallory. I think the only other player that may eventually fit that bill is Karasev, but he’s clearly very raw. And looked to have some jitters tonight. I think there’s also a huge chemistry issue. They look like they hate each other.
That’s THE PROBLEM “right there.”
At no point this season has Kyrie been a “pure shooter.” Wake up and smell the coffee, Mallory.
Beyond Kyrie and CJ, name me one pure shooter on this team…
Yeah, that’s a big part of the problem right there.
I’m not sure Anthony Bennett could score in the D-League.
Why? Kyrie is the problem. It’s starts and ends with him. I’ve been sayin all season that Dion is far from the problem, rather it has been our PG play that has been the problem. Nothing I saw tonight makes think I have been wrong. I am pleased with the D but until Kyrie begins to play with some semblance of purpose and shoots the way he had shown he us capable of shooting, we’re gonna keep having nights like this. You all can blame Brown all you want but I saw Kyrie miss open shot after open shot. Jack… Read more »
Can someone put out an APB on the Cavs offense? I don’t even really know where more Cavs points are supposed to come from; is anyone else really concerned by that? It just seems as if the team can’t score enough, but when I look at the sheet after the game, TT has 15/10, Kyrie has 18/10. Jarrett Jack and Earl Clark had fine games. So how does this team only score 80 points. There should be more talent than that even without Dion. It really feels like Kyrie’s inefficiency is killing the team right now. Somehow he has to… Read more »
I think Mike Brown actually punched Anthony Bennett in the face before benching him. I might be wrong. He might have swung and missed.
Is it time to start watching tape of Wiggins, Parker, and other college studs?
This is some of the most boring basketball. Kyrie looks like he’s ready to request a trade.