Podcap: Atlanta 126, Cleveland 125 (OT) (or, Failing at Failing)
2017-04-09https://soundcloud.com/ctb-5/episode-132-failing-at-failing
This game was insane: bonkers, nuts, maddening, infurating, exasperating, hilariously insane. Cleveland blew a 26 point fourth quarter lead and then lost in overtime to a healthy Hawks squad. In one of the biggest collapses in NBA regular season history, Cleveland committed eight turnovers in the final 12 and gave up a 44-18 fourth. This comeback/collapse had it all: listless play, YOLO threes, turnovers, stupid shots, a “never give up” attitude by the victor, and absolutely incompetent officiating.
Despite 88 points from the big three, 19-46 shooting at the line, a 53-45 rebound advantage, and 16-20 at the line (including 9-10 from LeBron!), and dominating every facet of the game for three quarters, the Cavs found a way to lose. As Tom noted on the podcast, if the Cavs had run the shot clock down to one and jacked up a three every possession in the fourth, they would have won this game. Instead, they took bad shots early in the shot clock, got into “peacock” mode, stopped passing, stopped defending, and put themselves in a position to get beat by a hungry opponent and officials caught up in the moment of the comeback.
Kobe Irving dropped 45 and 9 dimes on 30 shots. LeBron had a triple double with 32, 16, and 10 dimes. K-Love added 11, 16, and five dimes, while Korver added 11, and Fry another 12 . Still, it wasn’t enough as the Hawks got every call and went to the line a mind boggling 37 times. And we can count the bad calls. Despite the Cavs’ play, they wouldn’t have won without a pathetic showing by Leroy Richardson and Co. First, and most egregiously, there was the blown jump ball call at the end of regulation when LeBron threw the inbound, and Kyrie got trapped. Despite both Hawks standing out of bounds, Richardson failed to give the Cavs a timeout and called a jump ball between Irving and Bazemore, which Kyrie lost before the ball magically found it’s way to Paul Millsap who hit a baseliner to put it into overtime.
Then there was a J.R. Smith all ball block that was called a foul, and LeBron’s “foul” of Millsap’s three-pointer. And then the play LeBron fouled out on, possibly the single worst loose ball foul I’ve ever seen.
The King and Uncle Drew were none too pleased postgame.
So after all this, Nate Smith, Tom Pestak, and Samuel Meyer trudged to the podcast booth to cathartically rant about this insane game, the Cavs’ bizarre decision to cut DeAndre Liggins and sign Dahntay Jones, Ty Lue and his inability to manage minutes, why the Cavs aren’t just resting guys, the ridiculously bad officiating, the Cavs’ amazing ability to screw this one up, and so much more. Most importantly, they discussed why the Cavs are playing these guys when they’re losing anyway. They can’t even fail right.
As always, we can be found above on Soundcloud, iTunes, and Google Play.
Fortunately, LeBron is still the best player on the planet (see the game against Boston a few days ago). Unfortunately, this team is going to need to synchronize 100% between now and the end of the ECF for us to have a legitimate shot against GS. We need to be healthy and firing on every single cylinder we have to top that offensive beast. At the end of the day, LeBron and Kyrie can score enough to keep up with Curry-Thompson-Green. But I just don’t know who will consistently outscore Curry-Durant-Thompson-Green other than LeBron and Kyrie. Love has proven that… Read more »
I liked the Podcast, specifically identifying the fact that the Cavs seem to search for the same type of player (Old former star with no defense or toughness). They are the polar opposite of the Spurs who only go for players that fit the integrity of their system. Is this because Lebron is enamored with players of poor character? Perhaps, but Lebron’s paycheck is to lead the world in on court basketball IQ and put up numbers, he isn’t paid to put together a championship team. I love Lebron, but I don’t think he actually knows what type of player… Read more »
You miss the point. The Cavs do not particularly want past their prime old slow guys, but they have no draft picks, and nothing to offer FA’s but the chance to win a ring, so they only get leftovers. What few draft choices we had were used to trade for some of the slightly less slow old guys. This problem goes back to LeBron’s abrupt return. Obviously that was a great thing, but we had to give away about three young players and some draft picks to free up enough money (in about one day) for LeBron. If he had… Read more »
We are the #2 seed. Will lose to Raps. If we get there.
Nah. If Cavs beat Miami, Toronto will lay down like dogs to avoid seeing Cleveland in second round.
With the big 3 resting, I doubt we win tonight. Clearly, we have a tough time beating just about everyone right now.
I honestly don’t think they can beat a good college team with the big three sitting…
enh, whatever. Cavs rule, Warriors drool. They blew a 3-1 lead. Now THAT is ridiculous.
ruled, drooled – past tense.
Been thinking a lot about who the Cavs should bring in if this all ends disastrously like it appears it’s going to. Since Monty Williams is now VP Of Basketball Operations in San Antonio, they’d need to make a pretty big move to get him over. I say bring him in and make him President and coach. He’s coached in the Olympics. He’s from the Spurs’ system, and he’d be a guy who’d be hard to ignore. His firing at the hands of the Pelicans was easily the second dumbest move of the last five years in the NBA (after… Read more »
Very intriguing Nate…not to mention his amazing speech after the death of his wife at her funeral. I like it.
We could also have Doc running the show next year and CP3 at point. Anything is possible…
Totally not enamored of Doc or any of his disciples. Dude won one ring because of KG, the greatest shooter in NBA history (Ray Allen), and Paul Pierce. I could’ve coached that team.
I agree that Doc is TOTALLY OVERRATED. He hasn’t produced anything else out of the Clippers that Vinny D didn’t already.
Keep in mind, one of the things that was touted about Lue was that he was an assistant on those Celtic and then clipper teams. Doc is his mentor…
Coach + anything else is almost always a disaster.
Disappointing to see them lose that lead and ultimately the game at such a crucial point in the season. I fully expect to see them win the next two games, get the #1 seed, and really only get tested until the conference finals. They are definitely without their warts but the talent and LBJ are enough to get through the playoffs. The Finals are a different story and any one of GSW, SA, and HOU would worry me in the Finals. I’ll be at the game Weds cheering them on and I hope that all my playoff tickets gets used.
I hope you are right, but I suspect you have been smoking with Cols.
LeBron sitting tonight. Cavs went clubbing after the loss yesterday, so I’m not expecting big things.
http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/10/lebron-james-clubbing-after-losing-to-hawks/
They’ve checked out for the season I think.
Waiters, McRoberts, and Babbitt are all questionable for tonight. So, looks like a guaranteed Heat win apparently…
I would laugh at that…if there wasn’t a possibility of it being true.
Trust me, it hurt to type.
Good to hear B Werth’s take at the beginning of the ‘cast — I so respect his analysis. A couple of thoughts: After two games maybe we should consider that the Hawk’s bench is a match-up problem for the Cavs. Looks to me like we’re really seeing the effects of a ‘rookie’ coach this year. Last year they had David Blatt’s disciplined system framing everything. He didn’t relate well to the players individually, and so when he left they had a feeling of freedom and energy that carried them the rest of the way. This year, though, that lack of… Read more »
That was Griffin’s biggest mistake. Not locking Delly up for I believe it was going to take 3/15million before the spike in free agent salaries.
Is it too early to start talking about who leaves first, Lue or Lebron? This reminds me of Love/Blatt. Lue isn’t a good coach. Lebron deserves better. I wish he would have had Blatt’s back and just gave him a chance.
Who could we even replace Lue with that would garner LeBron’s respect and would be a decent coach? There is a dry market out there for vet coaches…
Unfortunately Mark Jackson probably. Although I wouldn’t mind JVG.
Ugh, no thank you. Mark Jackson was a shackle around the ankles of the Warriors. I’ve gotta think there is a reason JVG hasn’t coached since 07.
Doc Rivers might be available next year.
If the Clippers finally decide to blow it up, he might be. I still keep doubting it will ever happen.
Blatt had issues, specifically with regard to this team. I think Lue could be a good coach if 1) he learned how to manage games in any capacity and 2) if he actually got on his players hard when it is justified and the refs. He just is god awful at in game management of minutes and rotations. He also doesn’t seem to have any teeth with his guys this year. We certainly don’t ever see it during games. I have never seen him get angry at blatant lack of effort, selfish play, or idiotic turnovers. Come to think of… Read more »
There was no sign that Blatt had a clue of what to do in the NBA. Notice that the other 29 teams are not clamoring to hire him.
+1
Interesting take on the residual effects of the Blatt system. I was not super-impressed with David Blatt’s system, but I don’t think that he really had enough time (with all of the injuries, new players, etc.) to fully implement one. But it was getting close to him having enough time. Anyway, I don’t see much of a Lue system. In particular, having a rotation that does not completely fall apart when Lebron is not on the floor seems to be a consistent issue over the past two years. I’m not quite sure what to make of it. “But it worked… Read more »
What a stat from Mark Stein. NBA teams had won 1,005 games in a row when leading by 25 pts heading into the 4th quarter……. so we have that accomplishment going for us !
It always has to be Cleveland, doesn’t it?
Wow what a shameful stat to carry.
which means it is such an exception, we shouldn’t take that loss that seriously. If Cavs needed a wake up call, they got one.
They’ve had plenty of “wake up calls” this season. They need a swift kick in the a**.
lol, think that is what they got now. But, can take solace that, they can still win east if they get their act right, meaning not too late.
Sure. They woke up in time to hit the Miami clubs.
I just don’t know if it’s worth it to have to watch this team for six months…. What’s the point if the ride is so utterly miserable…
I’m completely baffled by this team and the coaching staff (and I’ll throw Griffith/Dan in there too). I’m quite honestly at a loss for words. I wish it was as easy as blaming Lue, and although he deserves every bit of it, I think this goes much deeper.
X’s and O’s be damned. Anyone think the last two games happens if Poppavich was coach? Cols always talks about NBA players are grown men and don’t need to be yelled at, but the Spurs are led by Poppavich and have been by far the most successful team in the past 20 years. Poppavich reams out his stars all the time. They are grown up enough to take it professionally. We think the cavs aren’t? Tired of Lue’s dead eyed zombie stare on the sideline no matter what is happening. How about a little fire? He is pretty lacking as… Read more »
Greg can get away with screaming at those guys because of his resume. Lue hasn’t even finished two years of coaching. He needs to find another way to be effective than yelling. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem he has anything.
Pop was yelling at them 20 years ago in 1999 when they first won.
Cols sez that grown men don’t need to be yelled at? We all yell at Cols! Of course, who knows how old he is. He sounds about 12, but apparently manages to buy beer.
He’s got kids haha so, decidedly, not 12.
Either Lue is incompetent or just plain ignorant. He has constantly contradicted himself about rest vs seeding, and is clearly exhausting the starters. That he hasn’t played Deron or the cut Liggins is insane.
Can it be both? I hope he gets fired after a 1st round exit, or Lebron is probably leaving.
Great podcast! Very therapeutic and needed!!
Cavs played with great pace through mid way into the second quarter, then they slowed way down. Is that fatigue? Is it assuming victory? Is it a coaching strategy? I’m disgusted with Lue, disgusted with Shump and Deron, and worried about the body language from Love. Hope the playoffs fix the malaise, if not, they go from winning as extreme underdogs, showing great heart, to falling apart as favorites to come out of the East.
Luke Walton, Thib, could have brought in a college coach, a tablet with a spreadsheet to manage minutes would be better then this joke as a coach. As someone stated if he’s trying to injure LeBron he’s doing a great job.
Great teams have underachieved before. We are going to find out very soon whether the cavs throwaway their opportunity to cake walk to the finals through the leastern conference.
I don’t think Kyrie’s defense is as bad as some say. He is blocking guys this season. I don’t see Isiah or Curry doing that.
For lack of better stats, 82games.com has Kyrie’s opponent PG has a PER of 25 as against Curry’s counterpart with 17. Curry is #3 among PGs in steals and 9th in rebounding, Kyrie falls outside 10 in both categories. As per blocks, Curry has one every 5 games and Kyrie one in every 3 games. DPRM, Curry is #16 and Kyrie is #80.
Still, Kyrie’s net rtg is +5.0 PER. Compared to last year, Kyrie’s offense improved, defense became worse just by a bit but net rtg is much better this year. So, Kyrie may not be the problem.
Without a true defensive shot blocker, integrity on keeping dribble penetration from happening is crucial. That’s where Kyrie is breaking down and the Cavs rotations are abysmal.
True, but his back court mate is not a good defender either compounding the defensive issues. I am not a Kyrie’s fan but he needs a defensive stopper next to him and a defense first backup PG who can play few minutes with him like Delly. JR Smith and Korver are not good defenders.
Yea, agreed, two wrongs don’t make a right. They need either great rotations and defensive schemes to hide their individually flawed defense. A Dikembe Mutombo eraser guarding the rim, or better individual defense.
+1. Bogut would have helped if healthy. A team needs some breaks to win, in Cavs case, they might have needed a break with Bogut being healthy.
Yea, it is interesting how much Bogut could have potentially helped. More troubling is the fact they seemed to pin all their hopes on him and were seriously mentally screwed when he went down.
Link please,
Curry:
http://www.82games.com/1617/16GSW1.HTM#pstats
Kyrie:
http://www.82games.com/1617/16CLE2.HTM#pstats
Steals and rebounds for PGs.
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/steals/sort/avgSteals/position/point-guards
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/rebounds/position/point-guards
added links and it is in moderation.
my links were deleted but you can go to 82games dot com, click team and then click on player stats.
Although we know the Cavs can “flip the switch” at times, they can’t do it that often. It is seriously looking like a long shot to make the finals. It is not out of the question that the Cavs will get bounced out of the first round. Where is Cols when you need him? The bench is a serious problem, and a good share of the blame must go to our favorite player. His chaotic rejoining of the team cost several young players and draft picks. The team keeps his pals. The Champ appears to be an excellent guy and… Read more »
No… Cavs def have a problem on defense. Been this way all year.
I remember an ugly loss to Lakers by 50 points.. That was worse with Kaman sleeping on bench..
This was an infamous meme for Cavs
I’ll be darned, the Lakers had a Clipper sleeping on the bench!
I think that was the Clippers.
That is a Laker uniform he’s wearing.