From Distance: Trade Grade Idiocy
2020-02-07Sometimes it is hard to tell whether some of the folks writing about the NBA have actually watched the NBA. Or to take it a step further, have any idea about how the salary cap or draft capital function.
Following the trade deadline, The Ringer website, soon to be purchased by Spotify, dropped a trade grade column that must have been written by a child with extensive NBA 2K-whatever experience.
Look, I can deal with a lot of bad takes. It isn’t really in my nature to go back and rub it in other people’s faces when they have a take that is terrible. I am fully aware that for every accurate prediction I have had, (Luka’s success, Sexton’s overrated hype), I have had some less than stellar calls, (Walter Edy Tavares’s NBA success, Dame Lillard as an overall minus). I think I have uttered the words “I told you so” approximately three times over my nearly 40 years on planet Earth. It’s not my style.
To be fair, I do have a tendency to tell people how it IS right now, so I don’t need to do it retroactively. I have been known to express my strong opinions as facts. But really only when I have thought about something a great deal. I digress.
So, it really takes a laughably AWFUL take by a writer or talking head to get me actively annoyed. Some dude at The Ringer succeeded. It was so bad, I’m not going to even link it here so he gets an extra click. It’s on that site and he isn’t a great writer. That should be enough to satisfy the bibliography Gods.
Cleveland Cavaliers
In: Andre Drummond
Out: Brandon Knight, John Henson, 2023 second-round pick (lesser of Golden State’s or Cleveland’s)
Getting nothing at the deadline for a valuable player like Tristan Thompson and his expiring contract is one thing; trading for another expensive center in Andre Drummond, who can decline his player option and hit unrestricted free agency this summer, makes it even more bizarre. Hanging on to Kevin Love, with his injury history, age (32 next season), and $91 million left on the books is inviting a lot of risk, even if there weren’t any enticing offers out there. How a team that should clearly be in “sell mode” ends up losing draft assets at the deadline is hard to fathom. Taking a chance on Drummond accepting his player option and sticking around for a season would be fine for a team close to playoff contention. That’s not Cleveland.
Grade: F
What is this dude babbling about? One can’t execute trades that weren’t there.
On TT:
Tristan Thompson is not an impact addition for any of the teams that had the right combination of contracts to trade for him. There was noise out of D.C. but ultimately the Wiz preferred to continue to play five shooters on their path to the abyss.
The teams that would appreciate TT’s services are more than ready to wait for any potential buyout. Thompson would be a pleasant pickup, but not a definite need for those championship contenders. I didn’t expect TT to be traded at all. I do expect him to be bought out post Drummond trade.
On Kevin:
It has been widely reported around the league that the Cavs think that another team should package a couple decent assets in order to acquire Love, while the other GMs believe Love’s salary, age, and production require the Cavs to toss in the extra-asset. There was no traction around the league for ANY trade.
Love’s mediocre play this season certainly didn’t stoke any potential fires. Altman, Love, and the rest of Cleveland should focus more on turning the rest of the team into a rational combination of guys instead of waiting for a trade. I don’t see it coming this summer either unless Altman finds religion on Collin Sexton and packages him with Love to some confused Sexton loving team.
On Draft Capital:
The lesser of two 2023 second round Picks is hardly a thing. Could it be repackaged at some point to grease another deal? Sure. But the Cavs hardly emptied their treasure chest.
On Andre Frickin Drummond:
It is easy to get seduced into thinking that “the modern NBA” has no place for non-shooting big men. When the Rockets are beating the Lakers with the shortest starting lineup since the early 60s, I understand how children can be confused into thinking the NBA is a wings’ game.
Let’s get this straight. Small ball can work.
Big Ball works better.
It’s not about size, it is about skill-set. When the Rockets traded for Russell Westbrook, they acquired a guard who cannot shoot from the perimeter. Russ might as well be Ben Simmons with a confidence disorder. The Rockets stumbled out of the gate because they went from playing with four guys who could shoot the rock with one rim-runner in Capela, to three guys who can shoot, a rim-runner, and guard aimlessly hanging around the perimeter or crowding the lane in the dunker’s spot.
To be average, a modern NBA offense necessitates three three-point shooters, a rim-runner, and a low-usage ball-mover. To be good, make sure that low-usage ball-mover can actually hit the three too when necessary. To be great, have a point guard who can shoot the three off the bounce and a center that can Pick and Pop AND/OR Roll.
Ladies and gentlemen, may I present to you the Dallas Mavericks.
Andre Drummond is a good to great basketball player who has never played with a decent point-guard, good stretch-four, and a three and D guy at the same time.
Tobias Harris and Blake Griffin each provided some real professional play at the four next to Andre over the last few seasons, but the Pistons were never able to pair him with a real lead guard.
Reggie Jackson has been either injured or horrendous for 90% of his Pistons’ tenure. Detroit’s playoff loss to Cleveland was hard fought, but that team featured almost zero perimeter shooting and was wracked with ball-stoppers.
Now, I’m not saying that playing with Collin Sexton and Darius Garland is going to make Drummond’s life much easier. What I am saying is that if you surround Drummond with four other guys who can shoot and someone who actually knows how to run a Pick and Roll, the offense will be just fine even in this “modern NBA”.
Drummond doesn’t have to be as effective as Rudy Gobert as a screen-setter and rim-runner to still be a positive offensive player.
Defensively, the Cavs desperately needed back line help to cover for the worst defensive back-court these eyes have ever seen. Again, I think Garland has potential to be a crafty defender while I am totally out on Sexton’s potential to be a viable two-way player. Sexton has Wiggins/Lavine disease. The tools are there while the effort is intermittent, focus terrible.
“What Ben, Sexton busts his tail every play!”
Nope. No, he does not. He is not an inherently lazy player, but he rests on the defensive end every third possession both in mind and body. There is simply no excuse for how many buckets he gives up in transition and/or by getting back-doored. When I analyze game film, I search out the guy who missed his assignment in transition. It is almost always Collin. He is the main problem.
Drummond helps clean up that garbage. He may not be a Gobert level defender, but he isn’t as far off as you might think. He has led the league two of the last three years in defensive efficiency according to basketball-reference. RPM doesn’t like him quite as much, nor does my eye test all the time, but he is absolutely a winning player.
Drummond will instantly be the best defensive big man the Cavs have employed since peak Anderson Varejao and is in the mold of Ben Wallace (for good and bad).
He moves incredibly well laterally, easily staying with all sorts of offensive players. That being said, I hope the Cavs change their defensive philosophy if they are going to start Drummond and Love together. The Cavs haven’t switched as much as a rule this year, but they should do it even less with Drummond as a back-line of defense. The defense should do its best to funnel the offense into him instead of require him to dance with guards on the outside.
So excuse me if I find an F Grade to be one of the worst takes of this NBA season. The Cavs had a chance to rejuvenate Kevin Love’s passion, cover the kids’ defensive mistakes, liberate TT to go to a contender, and turn expiring contracts into a trial period with one of the most productive, albeit old-school, big-men in the league. They took that zero risk chance all for the price of a 2023 second-rounder.
F.
You…might be wrong.
this andre the giant gambit just may work better than many think.. careful on the lighting up the hopium piipe prematurely, although, speaking of smoking, i am sure my amigo NOMAD still has some screens from the old days that we can borrow.. but call me cautiously optimistic.. not willing to give koby much in the way of credit.. when you are presented a gift.. u graciously accept and say thank you., but better outcome than i would have thought possible..
THEY GOT SMOKED LAST NIGHT DIDN’T THEY
Let us win this! 2 of their top 5 out.
No Kawhi or PBev tonight – Clippers off a B2B. Hopefully Cavs can be competitive in this one.
Nomad: now, if we rip off 5,6,7 in a row, then I might start believing.
This move makes me happy. I do not like jettisoning all your vets and going with all toddlers. It is hard to learn when you are getting blown out every night.
If you can keep it close-ish in the last 4-6 minutes, that is winning time. Defense tightens. Bad, lazy, stupid, or selfish play gets you beat. The other guys get ticked if you do those things. Peer pressure. Winning culture.
Well said. You’re absolutely right. I’ve no interest in players who do well most of the time and go missing when the opposition knuckles down. You have to be well-drilled, disciplined, know your team’s sets for it to work in crunch time. The more time this team spends in that contested zone of the last quarter, the better.
I’m excited to watch Drummond play. Nice article, Ben.
WAS THINKING THE SAME JOHNB—–FRONT OFFICE WANTS TO SHOW IMPROVEMENT / SET A POSITIVE TONE / VISION FOR PLAYERS / FANS FOR NEXT YEAR—BUT STILL KEEP THE HIGH DRAFT PICK—–I WAS THINKING AT FIRST —10– 20 FOR REMANIDER 30 GAMES —–GOING TO TAKE AT LEAST 5 GAMES FOR ALL PLAYERS TO GET USED TO PLAYING WITH DRUMMOND AND VICE VERSA—- WE COULD POSSIBLY GO 0–5 / 1–4 IST 5 GAMES DUE TO THE “GETTING USED TO EACH OTHER “—-FEASIBLY PLAY @ . 500 BALL REST OF THE SEASON WHICH I THINK WOULD CREATE ENTHUSIASM FOR BOTH PLAYERS / FANS
COULD WE / DO WE WANT TO MAKE A PLAYOFF PUSH——-MAGIC IS @ 8 AT 22 WINS BUT THEY HAVE BEEN PLAYING POORLY –1-9 LAST 10 GAMES —-NEXT IS THE WIZARDS A@ 18 WINS —–ANY THOUGHTS ???—-30 GAMES LEFT —ENOUGH TIME ???
I doubt the FO wants that. They want to keep the pick. Besides that I don’t see it happening. Takes time to integrate major new pieces. I mean even if they go 500 they end up with 28 wins. No way that is enough and I think 500 In the last stretch is probably as good as they will be.
It’s unlikely Nomad, but you’ve stimulated my interest in watching for February.
You never know how a new piece will gel, Drummond is a smart dude and I think the rest of the team, particularly the rooks and KLove are going to enjoy playing with him. I think March will see Cavs around 10-12 place, but up to 8 would be a stretch. It’s not impossible, but January and it’s god-awfulness is hard to forget.
No.
If we went, 15-15, we’d have 28 wins. No way 28 makes the POs.
They would have to go 2-8, 2-8, 2-8 for a tie. Too many bad teams in the east for that to happen. They are just going through a tough schedule stretch. Once it eases up, they will post some Ws.
CLF—TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU ON DRUMMOND—VERY ARTICULATE / INSIGHTFUL ON WHERE THE CAVS ARE NOW / WHERE HE WOULD LIKE TO HELP THEM LEAD TO—-THIS COULD BE ONE OF THE BEST TRADES IN FRANCHISE HISTORY
MICHAEL KIDDD-GILCHRIST / BUY OUT —-SHOULD CAVS PURSUE ?
Nate will probably say yes…I say no.
Loved Drummond’s interview… smart guy. Beilein was giddy.
https://twitter.com/Angel_Gray1/status/1226212632627159043?s=20
https://twitter.com/spindavies/status/1226228403151437824?s=21
Blazers got hosed last night – hoping they sneak into the 8th seed. Would love to see Lillard in the playoffs with the tear he’s on right now..
FWIW, spotrac has us at $107,806,027 IF ADrummond opts in next year. Estimated cap of $109,000,000.
That is for 10 players: Love, Drummond, LNJ, Exum, Osman, Garland, Sexton, Windler, KPJ, Fonzie. Plus a first round pick. 3 FAs: TT, Delly, Zizic.
Tax threshhold is $139 million. So we have space there. But the best we could do with a FA is use an exception, save for our own guys, of course.
Is this right on the roster?
Garland, Sexton, Cedi, Love, Drummond.
Exum, KPJ, Fonzie, LNJ, TT
Delly, Windler (inj), Zizic
10-day: Bolden
2 way: Wade, Mooney
Seems like we have 1 spot open. Might as well take a look at someone. Wing or SF would be great.
Carter Rodriguez mentioned Trey Burke, just as a flyer who played for Beilein…but another short guard, not too high on that…
i’d love to pick up Burke… bench vet to teach the kids the nuances of Beilein’s system? Also, “local” guy, from Columbus, went to Ann Arbor.
AGREE WITH BOTH OF YOU // VINTAGE / JOHNB —————AND YES HOPEFULLY THE PRACTICES / MORALE ARE UPBEAT / POSITIVE ATMOSHPERE ——TO CHANGE THE CULTURE OF AT LEAST BEING PROFESSIONAL / INSTILL A COMPETIVE NATURE THAT WILL WANT DRUMMOND TO STICK AROUND AND BE PART OF / CARRY OVER INTO NEXT SEASON ———–THINK OF WHAT HAPPENS FROM NOW AND ESPECIALLY THIS OFF SEASON WILL GREATLY DETERMINE NEXT YEAR AND THE CAVS SHORT TERM FUTURE ———-REMEMBER WE SHOIULD STILL GET A DECENT DRAFT PICK // WE ALMOST HAVE 2– 1ST ROUND PICKS WITH HOPEFULLY WINDLER HEALTHY NEXT YEAR // POSSIBLY T.T.… Read more »
Would love to see a Garland, KPJ, Cedi, Love, Drummond starting 5
Truly. I actually think Sexton could be a 20+ ppg sixth man of the year type guy off the bench in the vein of a Lou Williams. And I think he could be that right now. His game is eminently suited for that and with the lack of punch off the bench it would be his show to run. Hell I would still play him 30 mpg and cut Garland’s minutes down to around 25. Sexton gets the other 23 at pg. Then give KPJ around 28 as a starter. Give Sexton 7 minutes as his backup and Exum the… Read more »
Yeah due to the second round pick pretty much no downside to this. Henson and Knight were gone anyway. Drummond could be as well, but this is what second rounders are good for usually. Plus this team badly needs a change of pace and an injection of new blood/rim protection.
Only thing that I am wary about is Drummond checking out on d as well once he realizes how big of a mess he has to cover for.
^^^ this. Optimistic, hope the team can instil good practices that don’t destroy morale.
I haven’t seen Jim Chones this excited and tweeting so much in a while.
https://twitter.com/chones22/status/1226146624403116035?s=20
No surprise, of course.
https://twitter.com/spindavies/status/1225839723391995905?s=21
they already said TT coming off the bench IIRC.
*Applause*
I absolutely LOVED this piece.
Thanks Ben.
ALWAYS GREAT TO HEAR FROM YOU BEN —-AND AS USUAL ‘ JOB WELL DONE “—–WAS WATCHING THE LAKERS / ROCKETS GAME LAST NIGHT AND EVEN THOUGH THE ROCKETS WON LAST NIGHT / AGREE WITH WHAT SHAQ/ CHUCK WERE SAYING —-LONG TERM ” SMALL BALL ” WILL TAKE ITS TOLL BANGING AGAINST THE BIGS / GETTING BEAT UP / DEMORALIZED IN THE LONG RUN——YOU STILL NEED A “PRESENCE ‘ IN THE POST —-WHICH ” SUMMON THE DRUMMOND ‘ BRINGS ——-WENT BACK TO THE PRE 2012 DRAFT AND MOST SCOUTS WERE VERY HIGH ON HIM / BELIEVED HE WASN’T CLOSE TO REACHING… Read more »
Suns crushed Houston last night, though Russ did not play.
Great piece, Ben. Getting a 26 year old two-time all-star & the best rebounder in the league for nothing is always stupid, right? Most rational takes I saw went from B to an A. Zero risk. We are not luring a pricey FA in our current state so the cap space is not an issue. If he and Love click, we have a very good 4/5 combo. If we win some games Love’s trade value increases, or we keep him. As for TT, letting him go for nothing is not a win, but trading him for nothing is a loss.… Read more »
Awesome piece. Thanks
Great article! I also agree 100% that article was straight garbage, some of the other ratings were way off as well. 2nd rounders rarely ever make the league! This is a super low risk and buy extremely low opportunity.
So you really holding out 0 hope for Sexton ever becoming a decent player?
The ‘F’ grade is a ridiculous take. I don’t love Drummond, but he’s instantly probably the best Cavs player right now. And the Cavs got him for nothing.
Like you, the main thing I look forward to is an actual interior defensive presence. At some point in the NBA you have to be able to defend *somewhere* on the court.
And LO freaking L at the idea of a crappy 2nd being ‘draft capital’.
I don’t read The Ringer, no regrets.
Technically I think the Ringer called it “draft assets”. Note “assets” is plural. Im not sure how ONE terrible 2nd round pick over 3 years from now becomes pluralized “assets”, but obviously I’m just splitting hairs about the stupid take the Ringer provided.
I think it’s even the Warrior’s 2nd, so I highly doubt it will be a very high 2nd.
Agreed. The absolute bottom of the barrel nature of the 2nd rounder in question just further emphasizes the silly nature of pluralizing “draft assets” as the Ringer article did.
I would only “pick” such “nits” to emphasize Ben’s overall point.
Great article. I haven’t seen much negativity about the trade, but I guess I wasn’t looking in the right place.