Links to the Present: Different Looks Edition
2014-07-22
Summer league is over and the Cavs have added some additional players to round out the roster, so it is officially time to start speculating about what the starting lineup may look like. Mike Mayer of Fear the Sword has kicked off the discussion. His predicted lineup looks like it would be Kyrie Irving, Dion Waiters, LeBron James, Tristan Thompson, and Andy Varejao. He argues for Waiters over Wiggins from the standpoint that Wiggins is a rookie.
Defensively, Wiggins projects to be very good, but as a rookie, it’s unlikely that he would actually be any better than Waiters. At least not from day one.
So while Wiggins may be a better fit for this spot in theory, I would actually be pretty surprised if he starts over Waiters on opening night.
My guess is that Waiters leads the bench unit, but finishes games while David Blatt continually lets Waiters know he runs that second unit and is a huge part of keeping the team in games.
Mayer had me salivating when he mentioned this small ball four man lineup.
There is also the possibility that the Cavs could start Waiters at the two, Wiggins at the three, and LeBron at the four. I think Blatt will utilize that kind of lineup for stretches most nights, but I can’t imagine LeBron starting at power forward
Just add one okay rebounder for instant success and Sports Center “top ten” plays.
While the Cavs haven’t had trouble rebounding, they are still in desperate need of a big man. Haywood is ineffective. Dwight Powell is a wait and see prospect. Unfortunately, the list of available free agents that Chris Fedor of the Northeast Ohio Media Group put together compelled me to throw a fit like a fifteen year old girl. No, I don’t want Emeka Okafor. No, I don’t want 
Jermaine O’Neal. No, I don’t want Ekpe Udoh. Why has the world forsaken me? Each of these centers could bring something to the team, but they would have to have a conference with the Wild Thing to discuss when they get to have their injury and when he gets to have his injury.
Luke Sicari broke down the Cavs’ summer league roster player by player for Fear The Sword. There were no surprises, undrafted players stay unsigned and foreign vets will probably go back to playing overseas. Terry Pluto of The Plain Dealer, however, had some good insights into the Cavs summer league players. Andrew Wiggins is very teachable and responded when told not to shoot as many threes.
Wiggins was understandably excited and forced some bad shots. But when the coaches talked to him about it, he adjusted. Thursday, he was 3-of-5 from the field — and 15-of-20 from the foul line. That gave him 21 points. The coaches love how he attacked the rim.
Anthony Bennet is developing in ways not related to increased girth.
In one game, Bennett attacked the boards and had 14 rebounds. Several times during the week, he impressed by running hard on the fast break, catching passes at the rim and dunking. The Cavs like how he lost about 20 pounds. Now, they want him to increase his stamina.
Terry thinks Joe Harris has hit old man status. He is gonna be running off of picks to get his shots.
The Cavs like how Harris moves without the ball, and can run around picks to get open. They see him joining veterans Mike Miller and James Jones as outside shooters coming off the bench.
Terry also shut down the notion of Kyrie being traded for Kevin Love. First off, it’s impossible for him to be traded for at least six months when signing a max contract because of an NBA rule, and, secondly, it would make the team look horrible, since one of the reasons LeBron came back was to play with Kyrie. The team has to wait at least a year to trade Kyrie.
Did you know LeBron James is able to make decisions for himself? It may come as a surprise that the best basketball mind in the world is making his own basketball decisions, but Maverick Carter has confirmed this. And, after Bill Simmons suggested that LeBron was a genius, Brian Windhorst has penned a piece about LeBron’s incredible memory and mind.
It is perhaps one of James’ greatest gifts. And while those who watch James are typically impressed with how he uses his speed and skill to generate highlight plays, those who know James or spend a lot of time with him are more frequently blown away by the almost curious power of his mind.
David Blatt had an interview with Zach Lowe of Grantland. Blatt seems ready to just use the pieces the team has.
[Zach Lowe]The Heat had Shane Battier to guard power forwards so LeBron wouldn’t have to all the time. And Battier could shoot 3s. Can you envision Anthony Bennett as sort of a bigger Battier in that same role?
[David Blatt]I’m really happy with the way Anthony has come to our camp. He’s worked extremely hard, has improved his body, has improved his approach. He’s maturing. He’s on the right track. We’re gonna see what we can do with him.
Can you say Anthony Battier? That’s exactly what Blatt is envisioning.
International news is heating up. Matty D is one of the NBA players who is looking for a spot on the Australian team. Dante Exum along with Aron Banes and a group of lesser known players will all be at the camp in Canberra waiting to see who has made the final cut.
Dion Waiters was named to the USA Select team, which will face off against Kyrie Irving and the Men’s National Team during July 28-31 in preparation for the FIBA World Cup. Chris Fedor has the details at Cleveland.com.
The Canadian team failed to qualify for the FIBA cup in Spain this year and is looking to qualify for the Olympics in 2016. The problem is that not all of their stars are playing during their summer games. Andrew Wiggins, Tristan Thompson, and Anthony Bennett are not playing with the team for one of the Olympic qualifying tournaments. If Canada wants to succeed in the future, they’ll have to hope the stars want to play full summers with them. Also, according to Jason Whitlock, the Canadian team might be better if they just weren’t Canadians without that killer instinct. Craig Lyndall has Whitlock’s comments about Canadian players covered over at Waiting For Next Year.
Lastly, Andy is in Brazil, training with his national team.
Primeiro dia de treino,como é bom estar com vcs meus amigosFirst day of training,it’s so good to be with u my friends pic.twitter.com/rvpa6gPeS2
— Anderson Varejão (@VAREJAOANDERSON) July 21, 2014
like all you bloggers –I have been on the ” love / wiggins ” pendulum for the last 2 weeks playing devil’s advocate for both sides to the pt. where I think we are all getting a case of ” paralysis by analysis ” were we are overanalyzing and afraid to make either deal—I think it is time to ” pull the trigger ” and live with your decision –I would like to see them try to make a trade Bennett/ t.t. / and 2 1st round picks and picking up some of their salary cap——the ist round picks anymore… Read more »
I’ve been arguing with myself for a week over this move. Would they be better off trading away their depth for Love’s skill set? He’s the best stretch big in the league and that would help greatly. His rebounding would be offset by Andy, Thompson and Lebron, so they’d kind of be wasting one of his greatest traits since it would be a redundancy. His passing is what really intrigues me most about him. Having him and Lebron as frontcourt facilitators would be amazing. There’s the issue of not having a rim protector, but most teams, even title contenders don’t… Read more »
Agreed. I truly hope that all of the rumors are just that and that the Cavs not sell the farm for Love. I’m not in favor of trading Wiggins, I’d certainly not offer anything mor than Wiggins, Bennett and a lottery-protected first round pick. There’s no way I’d also part with Dion so we can help Minny salary dump bad players. Having a big 3 of Lebron/Kyrie/KLove with the rest of the roster consisting of vets on minimums, MLEs and second round picks won’t necessarily win us multiple championsips. And, with KLove, he is always a flight risk with free… Read more »
FLIP A FRIGGIN COIN—WHICHEVER TEAM WINS THEY GET TO CONTROL THE TRADE —-ENOUGH ALREADY !!
The media is making a big deal about the 30 day time period during which Wiggo supposedly can’t be traded. Does anyone know if this matters? For example, no one can sign free agents until 7/10, but tons of free agents come to terms with teams well before 7/10. The agreement is reached, it is just not formally executed.
Similarly, can teams agree to a terms of a trade during the 30 day period, but then just wait the 30 days before it is formalized? My guess is that they can. But maybe someone knows.
My guess would be that a trade can be agreed but is not official until after the 30 days so technically either side could back out but, like a player who did the same, the GM who backs out would probably lose a lot of credibility. There was talk of McRoberts not signing with the heat after LeBron left as technically he hadn’t signed with them – but both he and his agent in particular would have lost so much respect they had to go.
The 30 day time period does matter because it dictates when teams can actually formalize deals and make them ‘stick’. It’s not unheard of for teams to come to terms and then something happens in-between agreed upon terms and the actual signing that negates the whole thing. Essentially, if we come to terms with the Wolves, several things can happen in between time that can prevent the deal from actually happening. For example, the Warriors could add Klay Thompson into the agreement. Or, Wiggins could get injured or publically say he doesn’t want to play for the Wolves and that… Read more »
It’s amazing to me how the Wolves seem to have taken a position of power in all of this. When Howard was leaving the Magic, it was clear that they ‘had’ to make a deal and one way or the other they were going to get shafted because other teams new they were in a weak positon to potentially let thier superstar walk and get nothing in return – or accept a subpar offer. Similarly with Melo left Denver, it seemed clear that they were in a ‘weak’ position and would just have to put together something to meet the… Read more »
The Knicks sold the farm to acquire Carmelo and I’m praying that the cavs don’t make the same mistake for Love.
Debate is nice, but it becoming taxing, much like the LeBron talk. I trust Griffin. He hasn;t made a flawed move yet. Truthfully, we really know nothing. Sources can be right or wrong or even a lucky guess, but in the end, I wouldn’t be surprised if it is all wrong.
If we get Love, I’m fine with it. If we don’t I’m fine with that too. Either way, the Cavs will be much more exciting than they were last year and the years before that.
Word. Wholeheartedly agree.
But we can still get Love before the deadline. The Cavs will make the playoffs with 0 further transactions. There shouldn’t be a rush.
Well said, John. I agree with this completely. Either possibility is a good one, and if we assume Griffin is a) smart and b) has tons of info we don’t have (about which other offers are out there, etc.), then its hard to really be made with his decision.
This is almost the exact same argument why the cavs shouldn’t throw the farm at Minnesota to get Love
http://espn.go.com/blog/chicago/bulls/post/_/id/19926/bulls-still-exploring-marriage-with-love
For those who think Love is a numbers guy/not interested in winning: this is false.
I live in Minnesota, been watching him for years. The guy wants to win. Biggest news he made last year was he started a locker room scuffle because two guys on the bench were pouting that they didn’t get enough minutes at the end of a close game (JJ Barea was one of them) and refused to get in the players huddle during a timeout. Love called them out for being selfish and not supporting the team.
Minnesota has to be enjoying this they have now created a ” bidding ” war where they will receive more than what love is actually woth—I can see cavs making trade—wiggins ( although I would miss seeing him blossom into a star under LeBron’s mentoring ) / bennett / and future # 1—but now to throw in another # 1 —that is potentially 4 starters or solid subs ( 192 minutes a night vs 48 min’s a night ) think that price might be too high —when you are giving up potentially 4 starters for 1 all star that kills… Read more »
http://www.sheridanhoops.com/2014/07/23/exclusive-bulls-have-offered-gibson-mcdermott-and-mirotic-for-love/ . That’s a very good deal for Minny. Also, Thibs can then play Love 42 minutes a night.
I know that I’m probably in the minority, but I hope that Minny grabs this deal. The price we’d need to pay to better this deal is far too high and I don’t want to trade away all of our young players and draft picks for one superstar. If the Spurs showed anything it’s that depth and a flowing offense can trump a team with a big three and nothing to back them up. People keep saying that Wiggins is 2-3 years away from making an impact, but I think that’s just not true. With Lebron and Kyrie (and Dion)… Read more »
Agreed wholeheartedly. Then when Love breaks down in the playoffs from over-use, and escapes to L.A., we’ll look like geniuses.
I think we are overrating Wiggins’ D a bit. He has the tools to be very good. But he isn’t yet. Watch the Summer League game where he tries to guard Jabari. He did some nice things, but Jabari also out-physicalled him several times.
I remain torn on the trade, but completely understand why the team might give up Wiggins for Love.
You’re evaluating based on the very first summer league game of Wiggins’ career?
@Nate – What are you evaluating on? What evidence is there that Wiggins is an elite NBA defender? I am serious. If you have some, I would love to see it and change my tune.
This Mirotic guy must be the real deal. I trust your opinion, who are his NBA comps? I just did some quick research and saw young Hedo Turkoglu and Ryan Anderson as most likely. Definitely solid. Taj Gibson is a nice player, but he’s not moving the needle unless you’re in win-now mode. Doug McDermott… who the hell knows if he’ll be good? Worst case scenario he’s a lethal shooting specialist. Kevin Love is a beast. I can’t believe that this is the best offer they can get for him. I think people might be slightly underestimating his ability to… Read more »
cwzagger-you make some very valid pts ( things I have constantly played out in my head as I am sure the cavs brass has also )—there are many WHAT IFS INVOLVED with either option– do we roll the dice and try to win now sacrificing our future ( how much do we want a championship –at what cost )—do we gamble and not make the trade hoping all the young players develop together/ and also allowing cap flexibility to add talent where needed –I think this is the constant struggle we are all trying to deal with and come up… Read more »
Interesting look at how the cap will affect the Love trade if we want to use the non-guaranteed contracts: http://insider.espn.go.com/blog/nba/rumors/post?id=28470
There has been talk of a third team getting involved in the trade to make things work. I know that we have talked about Dieng from the TWolves, but would anyone here trade Waiters if it meant we could get Noel? Would you trade Waiters for Noel straight up?
If we traded Waiters for Noel straight up, I wouldn’t even trade for Love
Kyrie/Delly
Wiggins/Jones
LBJ/Miller
Thompson/Bennett
Noel/AV
Just try and score on that first unit.. Kyrie and LBJ will be enough offense
Sure. I’d do a Waiters for Noel. I highly doubt the 76ers would though.
Assuming the Kevin Love trade would involve Wiggins and some combo of Bennett/Waiters/Thompson/picks, the Cavs end up with K-Love (Team A) or with the others (Team B). So looking at this coming season, Year 1: Team A has more star power and offense than Team B. Team B has more depth and defense than Team A. Team A is more likely to win now but ties up the salary. Team B is more likely to take time but allows flexibility. Years 2-3 are where we run into some problems, because Team A is now more difficult to improve than Team… Read more »
agreed if the proposed trade of wiggins/ Bennett / draft pick is what Minnesota settles for—-LET’S DO IT —-lbj/ love / kyrie / Anderson / dion all have high basketball i.q’s / passing skills —blatts type of players / team—it could be something very special to watch and for opposing teams very difficult to defend—-believe our bench is strong enough to give quality minutes to rest the starters —– ENOUGH OF ALL THE TALK—-MAKE THE TRADE SO WE CAN ALL GET ON WITH OUR LIVES AND START BLOGGING ABOUT DIFFERENT CAVS CONCERNS
I might be alone here, but I think Dion is more valuable than Wiggins right now. It would be fun to watch Wiggins grow, but he has a lot to learn and it will take time. Dion was playing at a very high level after the All-Star break last year (a fact that a lot of people fail to appreciate – 19 pts, 4 As, 46/38/71 in 32 mins), has worked his ass off this summer, and has a chip. If we give up Wiggins + picks for Love and keep Waiters, the following team has enough depth and offensive… Read more »
You are not alone. Dion is more valuable: RIGHT NOW. But Wiggins (1) has more projected upside, (2) is more versatile, (3) is a better defender, and (4) is a better fit alongside Lebron.
That’s why I’m in the camp of “wait until after the season starts”. Showcase Dion’s talents (he’ll look better than Wiggins), increase his trade value, then make him the focal point of offers.
The reason that Cleveland teams hasen’t win anything in 64 years is stupid mistakes, giving away Wiggins, Dion, TT and Bennett + a first is stupid. Love is not a good match with LBJ ‘s team, he is self center and he thinks he is the second comings of JChrist. All them people will produce more points + Rebounds and assists than Love stinks yeh yeh. Go Cavs.
I don’t think anyone is offering Wiggins, Dion, TT, Bennet, and picks for Love. Did you see any rumors along that line? That is just crazy.
I haven’t seen reports giving away that much. BUT, even if that’s the case you could argue “a bird in the hand is worth more than 5 in the bush”. All that means is that Love is a “sure thing” a known commodity in terms of what he can and very likely will continue to do for the next several years as he’s just now entering his prime. I too like Dion and looking forward to seeing how Wiggins and Bennett will develop. But truth be told, neither is likely to be top 5-10 players in the league. Wiggins has… Read more »
Very simple, Love has been the face of Wolfs franchise for the last six years and if he is sooooo goooood how come they haven’t gone to playoffs even once. TT, Wiggins and whoever + a first rounder for Love will deplete the Cavs team and leaves us with no bench and no cap flexibility . If I was Love I would sign with Wolves and be happy to have my own team, he is not going to be the go to guy and his production will go down . LBJ will make every body better, imagine instead of Bobby… Read more »
He is self center because , instead of leading his team, he wants to pack his bag and leave. Does anyone remember 2010 Cavs and years that followed . Where is loyalty and where is leadership ? Self Center.
Tony, you have some interesting things to say and obviously feel strongly enough about the Cavs future to put them into writing. However, I urge you to take a little time and learn something about the Timberwolves history during Love’s years. Putting the team’s overall performance on Love disregards and neglects some truly awful decision-making by Minnesota’s front office that is primary in their struggles.
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=p6wpvb8
Let me keep my brand new shiny Wiggins!
Kylie is really getting some hate. Get ready for him to break into 25/10 territory. Lebron makes good players great.
So we lost Deng and might be picking up Dieng. All we did was buy a vowel.
Well played, sir
What is the name of the “moneyball” guy the Cavs have working for them? If he pulls this off they need to make a movie . . .
ESPN REPORTING THE TRADE FOR LOVE WOULD BE WIGGINS/ BENNETT/ AND FUTURE # 1 —–I COULD LIVE WITH THIS AS WE ARE STILL KEEPING DION
espn reporting cavs making trade to jazz—felix/ 2nd round draft pick for lucas / murphy and a third plyer—-appears cavs are clearing up cap space to make THE BIG TRADE —–WILL THEY MAKE THE TRADE BEFORE THEY SIGN WIGGINS
This is pure speculation . . . and I don’t understand all the ins and outs of salary restrictions . . . but could it be that all Gilbert is concerned about is one stinkin’ championship . . . and he’s willing to do and pay anything allowable to win it. After they win a championship, they try to keep Humpty Dumpty together somehow by keeping two of the three max players (and hopefully will have kept Wiggins, too) and between the two max players and Wiggins will be able to continue to contend. That’s pure speculation. Otherwise, I can’t… Read more »
Yeah, Waiters, Bennett, and three #1’s for K Love, Rubio, and Dieng.
Ok. That was tongue-in-cheek. We’d have to score over 150 points every night if Irving and Rubio were our guards.
I was thinking the same thing, except without Rubio. Maybe the salary could be worked out by paying AV more and including him, with the understanding that he be immediately brought out, and resign with the Cavs a month later. He could use the rest anyway.
albert very good pros and cons —-I have been very strong on my feelings of not trading wiggins but then I revisit our situation a year ago—-earl Clarke/ gee at small forward / injured–attitude Bynum at post / brown returning home as head coach—–suddenly our so called ” present ” problems don’t seem so bad——either way trade or no trade the cavs are going to be more enjoyable/ competitive team to watch / support this year —–I am like the rest of you bloggers—–too many headaches / restless nights trying to play g.m lately . and solve the cavs problems—going… Read more »
I know man, the cap implications are a real consideration here. I honestly am torn on this. In an ideal world, I’d like to see how the team gels for a few months and revisit the idea closer to the trade deadline. But there’s a real chance he could get dealt elsewhere in the meantime. Here’s a quick list of Pros and Cons I came up. I’m sure there are a ton more, but this is just off the top of my head. (This is assuming the deal is some permutation of Wiggins/Bennett for Love, and Love signs a max… Read more »
I’ve been firmly in the “don’t trade Wiggins for Love” camp, but I just had a random thought that kind of jolted my thinking.
What if Anthony Bennett has an Al Harrington-type career? Not unreasonable.
What if Andrew Wiggins career is more like DeMar DeRozan with better D and less scoring? Also possible.
If those two outcomes occur, I’d seriously regret not making the Love trade. I tend to overrate player potential in general, so it’s such a tough call. I don’t know what I want anymore.
You are absolutely right, on one can know how a rookie or young players career will turn out, although you can take educated guesses. But, there is no doubt about what maxing out the salary cap will do. You might recall, there was a lot of take about not offering KI the max, because so far he has not shown he deserves it. But — at that time — it was probably the smart thing to do. For one thing, no one thought any top end max player would be coming to make better use of that money. But now… Read more »
Agree wholeheartedly. And you didn’t even mention that two of those three max contract players have missed a lot of time in their playing careers due to injury; or the lack of other proven +defenders aside from Varejao, another oft-injured player…
We run into the same problem in Year 1 as the Heat just did after four years of contending — a stretch in which they were painfully close to going 1-for-4. A championship is never guaranteed; adding K-Love doesn’t change that.
I thnk the bulls interest was intentionally leaked by Minnesota to put bidding teams in a somewhat panic mode and create an overinvestment trade —hope we don’t fall for this –still think the cavs should use the 30 day grace period after signing wigins to really evaluate his talents –have LeBron/ kyrie etc workout with him and get their true feedback—would it be good to have love on the team—hell yes —but at the right/ fair trade value
The parts begin to move:
https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/491716823331528705
Cavs trade Felix, future 2nd rounder and $1M to Utah for non-guaranteed contracts of John Lucas, Malcolm Thomas and Erik Murphy. “In Murphy, Lucas and Thomas, Cavs get three non-guaranteed contracts to facilitate trades — or a trade. Another step toward Kevin Love.”
That’s $3.36 million in non-guaranteed, and Felix’s $800,000 guaranteed.
Which means we won’t have to throw in Waiters or Thompson into the Bennet + Wiggins proposal to get the trade to work. We can’t possibly take Kevin Martin’s terrible contract back AND keep Love long term. It would cost us picks we wont have after making this trade to move Martin somewhere for cap relief to resign Love after this year. As much as losing our guys would hurt, THAT is the part of this trade that comes at too high a price. Bennett, Wiggins, Harris + cap fodder we just acquired from Utah+ 2 first round picks for… Read more »
The only trade for Love that makes sense involves KI due to salary limitations.
Not that I would like to see KI go, but what is with the “make the Cavs look bad” theory? Trading AW would make them look worse. Same deal with “LeBron came back to play with KI”. Sez who? If he has any sense, he came back to play with AW. As he hits his 30’s, you think he wants to be the only guy on the team that can play any D?
By my understanding, KI can’t be traded for 6 months because of his max contract signing.
How on earth would trading a draft pick (essentially) look worse than trading a guy you just publicly committed to? The logic is non-existent with this one, Raoul.
And by “this one” I meant your comment. Wasn’t trying to be offensive.
Gordan, The problem is the Salary cap. KI is signed to a max contract, but is at the very low end of max talent. He makes about 4 times as much as AW will. He is NOT 4 times better. If the Cavs trade KI for Love, they have to throw in some more stuff. If the Cavs trade AW for Love, the Cavs have to throw in more stuff. People could have a good argument about if AW is likely to wind up being better than KI or KL. But there is no argument about getting him cheap for… Read more »
You almost make me hope Wiggins sucks with how much hype you put on a kid who hasn’t played an NBA minute.
The point is, you can’t trade a guy to a max deal, publicly commit to him being a “piece” of the puzzle, and then ship him out two weeks later because you found something more attractive. Teams don’t do that. No player would ever trust this front office again.
It isn’t about how much $$ he makes. There is a ZERO percent chance Cleveland or Minnesota have even mentioned “Kyrie Irving” in trade talks. Period.
sign a guy to a max deal*
Just put Kevin Love at the point after Derrick Rose’s knees explode again.
What salary limitation?
I’m taking all these “reports” with a grain of salt. We really know nothing until it happens. To many contradictions. Haven;t we learned with all the LeBron “reports”?
Keep calm, move along, really nothing to see here … yet.
Latest “Insider” rumor per ESPN is that Minnesota wants us to take back Kevin Martin in a deal and we are demanding Dieng. Saying that Waiters or Thompson might now be included along with a first rounder, Wiggs, and Bennett. Correct me if I’m wrong, but if we take back Martin’s terrible contract (he freakin’ sucks), we’d almost have to give up Wiggins, Waiters, Bennett, and Thompson to make salaries match, correct? Are you kidding me? If it weren’t for salaries, we shouldn’t give up anything more than Wiggins. I understand Bennett makes salaries work. But Wiggins, Bennett, Waiters, and… Read more »
What the hell are the Bulls gonna do with Noah, Gasol AND Love?
Run Kevin Love at the point after Derrick Rose’s knees explode again.
One question regarding Kevin love trade:
To make the trade workable from a salary cap standpoint, we have to offer more than wiggins, Bennett, and a 1st round pick. That’s about 10million worth (Kevin love is 15 million). We need about 5 million more. Both waiters and Thompson will make about 5 million next year. My question is, if possible, who would we rather lose from a basketball standpoint? (I know, lebron’s agent is Tristan’s agent and lebron mentioned him in the letter, so this is unlikely.) Because personally I’d rather lose Tristan than Dion.
What do you think?
I’d rather lose Thompson than Waiters and it isn’t even a close discussion in my opinion.
Waiters still has an incredibly high ceiling. He’s improved in all aspects of his game since he came into the league. He’s shooting better and getting to the line. He plays with a passion for the game. He has All-Star potential.
Thompson is a backup 4 on a contender. He’s not a starter. His offensive game is bad and defensively he leaves a lot to be desired.
If we’re giving up Wiggins, Bennett, AND Thompson, we better get Dieng back.
The Cavs are said to be looking to sign player to short-term deals that then can then thrown into the trade. So, if you’re Jameer Nelson you may be falling ass-backward into a pile of free money.
We have $1.4M in cap space or something like that. I don’t fully understand the CBA, but I don’t think we can go out and sign $5M worth of FAs just to ship to Minnesota when we don’t have cap space.
We could use the non tax payer mid level (5.3 mil) and flip that guy after December 14th…sets up a trade deadline deal nicely.
Minnesota will clearly insist upon Waiters or Wiggins – or no trade.
We may get to decide between Bennett & Tristan . . . but again I’m betting that Minnesota will ask for Bennett.
I see where you’re coming from. As Lebron ages he’s probably going to be more of a PF than a SF. PF is also Love’s natural position. Waiters could be a star on another team and unfortunately either he or Wiggins has to be part of a conceivable Love trade.
I still think that a three way with Philly makes the most sense. Twovles could get a combo of Thad Young and Bennett to replace Love along with some draft picks.
Actually, the larger salary/batch of salaries traded has to be no more than 150% of the smaller batch, from my understanding of the NBA CBA. So as K-Love is about 15.7 million, the total value of the Cavs’ contracts needs to be at least 2/3 of that and no more than 3/2 of that, so between ~10.5 and ~23 million.
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mbtbgop
It took some doing to show an example of a trade where the Cavs are sending out just about $11m in salary in exchange for Love, but apparently the stipulation is actually that the Cavs need to be within 5 million of the incoming value. AB’s contract is 5.5m, and Wiggins’ projects to be just about the same, so this is what you’re looking at. As long as they’re within 5 million (10,7xx,xxx) of Love’s value, the trade works.
http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q84
Question 84 is the one you want
Yeah, it’s really heady stuff, but at the end of the day, the above concern that Bennett + Wiggins for Love doesn’t work in terms of salary appears to be unfounded.
The bigger issue is whether Bennett + Wiggins for Love is a good idea.